Tony D
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Posts posted by Tony D
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Air pressure in the float bowls is regulated by a modulator ring at the entrance to the main carb throttle body to give incrementally more pressure in the float bowls, compared to the throttle bore itself.The suction piston still works THE SAME as on a non-blown through carburettor, as there is STILL a pressure differential between the front of the carburettor and the back. Needle diameter is not done on a lathe unless you are making a new needle from brass stock. You have to chuck it in a lathe or drill, and use crocus cloth on the various jet-metering-steps to remove material. On an SU you HAVE to go from a state of LEAN to RICH while tuning the needle taper---not exactly what you want to do on a turbo car.
I went through hell one summer in 79-80 tuning a single draw-through SU for a 2.6L car...... I can tell you from experience, it's FAR EASIER to do this via standalone EFI.
The needle stations do NOT correspond to rpm! The correspond to load / manifold vacuum referenced points. It may be at one station at 1500rpm, and the same station at 4000rpm---the difference being throttle position and load imparted to the engine. You have to determine which station you are at by a tool that sticks up therough the damper cover, which shows your stations scribed in lines...you makre load and rpm -vs- AFR and make your needle adjustments from there.
Like I said, the needles will be done from Lean to Rich, so if you go too far, you are over-rich, and get to start all over. Hopefully you are good taking notes and know the diameter you started with, and where you went too rich, and can go back on your next needle to the righ diameter. You get real good with light touches using 600 grit crocus cloth dabbed with mother's polish to take .0005" or less off the needle at a time.
Oh yeah, and each time you do the stations, don't get that cloth on the previous station, or you screw it up.
And make sure you put that needle back into the piston EXACTLY where you took it out from, relative to total length extended into the jet body or you will be off---making you sand the wrong position the next run...
And yeah, you gotta do TWO of them EXACTLY the same instead of just one...
And that means you will get really really good at pulling the suction domes and pulling the needles out and putting htem back in...
And we are pursuing this WHY again?
Suffice to say, you can blow-through an SU. The jetting does not have to be operated much differently that the N/A taper IF you use the modulator ring and riase the float bowl level. (I wish I had known about this back in 80 for my drawthrough as I could have used an adkustable FPR to raise float bowl level on-boost and keep the needle a bit fatter for better off-boost fuel economy) Problem is you will be estimating how much fuel you can pump through an open orifice at incremental pressures as the boost goes up.
At some point you will run past the original SU inlet nozzle's capacity to fill the bowl and keep the fuel level steady, your float bowl level goes down, and you run lean on-boost.
BOOM!
For all the effort to get them half-assed working correctly, you would be WORLDS AHEAD gutting the SU's, putting a 1.5" spacer behind each of them, installing a 1000CC/Min injector facing forward towards the throttle plate, and drive them using a Megasquirt.
I 100% guarantee that the Megasquirt setup will deliver MORE power, BETTER mixture control, and take LESS TIME TO SET UP than working with the SU's.
On an N/A car, dialing in SU's is one thing. Go turbo, and they start falling short. They weren't designed to work that way, and you are really trying to make a hammer do the job of a scalpel during brain surgery!
Oh yes, and on the "foam filled floats" issue. The stock brass floats tend to collapse around 10psi. You guys are working way to hard to make a BAD idea work poorly (at best)...
Been there, done that....never again!
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What was the phrase of a renowned road racer? (Paraphrased)
"You have enough power when you can leave black marks from the exit of one corner, to the entrance of the next!"
600HP in an S130 won't do that....not enough power. More power, please!
(THey ran in competition in the early 80's with as much at 820HP, so this is what could be referred to as a "Conservative Target" of only 600HP!
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If lead doesn't (can't) crack, how do you explain the dreaded b-pillar crack?
Reading closer you will also note I said if applied properly, and mosre importantly thinly. This is not the case at the B-Pillar solder joint.
More importantly, the Z's did have polyester filler OVER the body solder as the main contour putty. This is a weight issue on a sports car.
Had they done a solder/contour job like on a 1957 Chevy, chances are good the B pillar wouldn't crack at the top.
But they didn't, they used polyester, and as a result, it cracks. The only solder in that joint is ther for joining panels and giving a non-moveable base for the Polyester. Unfortunately the body solder in the joint...it flexes, and the polyester doesn't after the years...
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Jeff's car is really sedate and could easily be used in daily driven service. Given he gets 3psi at almost any rpm, the torque below boost threshold is very good making for great drivability. He can better give performance on the Elgin Grind, but as I recall he would break 30mpg during cruising. EFI and Turbos are a great combination!
BTW, that is not the "radical" grind from Isky's Turbo Lineup. Ron is like a mad scientist when it comes to Nissan L-Grinds, he has some FAR more radical stuff out there, you just need ask! LOL
But like Jeff says...probably not for the street. Hence my admonitioning and chiding Jeff about 'ANY' Turbo Z! LOL
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So your saying my paranoia was justified?
Halleluija!
LOL
We got another system into the car now, but that TEC is just laying around. Maybe I will "bite the bullet" and install it in my street car. It really gave great service (17 World Land Speed Records for N/A 3 Liter Classes), but the Damper we installed was setup for the new system, and when we started having high-rpm sensor issues (8500+ rpm) we just gave up. We didn't have much luck with other sensors, but knowing this now it may help with the unit in the future.
We never actually ran in closed loop. Due to cam overlap, it was on blend till almost 50% throttle. We didn't use the unit at partial throttle, this was full on racing at Land Speed Events. I was "told" it was a WBO2.... hence my misunderstanding of the question above!
In the case of the TEC2 taking a 1V switched input, I'd go with the switched output from a WBO2 controller. But if there is a WBO2 interface already available.... hmmmmm....
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he he he he!
A professionally prepared head can run $1500+
This will be for a head that WORKS. Not some hog-job.
The power of the Nissan Engine is in the head. Don't skimp there.
For the prices mentioned, you can buy a rustbucket ZX Turbo Donor Car and be well on the way to the dark side...and have loads more power than you will ever get with an N/A setup.
Good Luck!
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Make a mold, use the original dash as the plug. Make your dash, install it.
Simple!
if it's free form, glue blocks of poly foam (or use the spray foam) to rough out the form you want, then lay your laminate over it. Finish as required.
Simple!
(Lots of details left vague, in the spirit of the original post! LOL)
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Got to agree with Racer X here!
Having been fortunate to take a body arts classes from people who used lead daily (a crazy lot those guys were !) they were the first to tell you "Anything that happend to Bondo can happen with lead!"
It will fall off, it will crack, it will rust underneath... It's all in the way it's applied, and the skills of the technician applying it.
Most of the old-timers were using Bondo, and GLADLY didn't look back! My instructor would skim coat over lead simply because of economics: "Look, you can metal finish this panel in another 50 hours, or you can finish it now in 2 using a bondo skim coat." Lead work required a lot of filler, then sloooooowly filing it down flush and smooth. If you went too far, you basically started over. If you were close, you simply applied primer to fill. Sand, reprimer, sand, reprimer, sand.... Many times people used Acid-Based fluxes for tinning the base metal, and if you didn't tin COMPLETELY there was this nice little pocket of ACID and BARE METAL. Now it rusted/corroded from UNDER the lead to the backside of the panel where nobody notices it...then the water gets BEHIND the lead....and like RacerX said: POPOUT! There were caveats all over about properly cleaning your tinning flux as the acid would ruin the nitrocellulose paints---caused swelling in the finish topcoat. Nasty stuff...
But these guys also WORKED the metal. The key in any filler is to get the surface as close as possible to evenly smooth WITHOUT filler. That is the definition of "metalworking." As long as either filler is thin, they will hold. Long term, lead will not heat-shrink-pullup like most of today's poly fillers, but epoxy microbaloons mixed and applied is better than bondo anyway... I digress...
Back to "Work the metal". In the old days after you welded a panel, you hammerwelded it... That is two men worked the weld with a torch and hammer-dolly to bang it down flush so the weld was indistinguishable from the metal surrounding it. Lots of dolly and hammer work, lots of shrinking...
By metal finishing, from what I see there, it looks like they rounded the camber plate to the weld, and the weld to the strut tower area, nothing more. If you fill over a structural weld, you are asking for a catastrophic failure to come up and bite you! Most sanctioning bodies forbid grinding or smoothing of welds at all---especially when dealing with crash structures and suspension reinforcements.
The most I would do is weld a lot of filler on there, and grind it back down flush. There is not any reason to need any filler if you properly work the metal, and then topcoat directly over the weld. At least then if something is cracking from being worked too thin, you will see it through the paint.
You put it under lead or bondo, and it's not going to show up until you hit a bump and your strut tries to open your hood in mid-corner!
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The second cam is an Isky part, this cam is a little more radical, and I would not recommend going past this specification for any turbo L28.
ANY Turbo L28 Jeff? I did the gearing checks and I need 28" tires and 650HP+ if limited only to 7500rpm.
ANY?
LOL
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Just some information...
I approached Splitfire for some plugs back in the 1990's. They are Autolite Plugs, so don't kid yourself, they are a special electrode on an Autolite. At least at that time...
Anyway, they made up a run of plugs for me (Champion D15Y Equivalent).
The results of installing those plugs on a turbocharged, gas engine which was operating 24/7 attached to a full load dyno (electrical generation) and had Kenicocks (meaasures cylinder pressures), as well as EGT and AFR feedback on it was the following:
Cylinder pressure variations were reduced considerably. They fired MUCH more evenly.
Cylinder EGT's conformed to within a 25 degree total variance on a V16 engine. This was almost unheard of in this service, normal variance accepted was 100 degrees cylinder to cylinder.
Fuel consumption was reduced by 50,000CFD, and resultant Heat Rate (horsepower produced compared in a ratio of BTU's consumed) was the BEST the sets had EVER seen. The OEM came out to check our figures, they were that much improved.
Dyno readouts (KW Metering) were ROCK STEADY, misfires went almost totally away. They acted more like TURBINES coming up to full power, than ICE's!
Downside: They lasted around 100 hours, as opposed to 350-450 hours for the Champions. The center electrode was worn away and the gap increased to the point of misfire.
Had Splitfire used a more durable center electrode, these plugs would have been a hot seller in that market. Now I understand they make platinum tipped plugs, that may help, but innovators and experimenters are not going to try there at that site again--which is a shame.
You can say all you want about them being a farce or whatever, but I was privy to this testing firsthand, and I tell you they worked astoundingly well.
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I gap for smoothest idle, and least dropout on the top end. Whereever that is, that's where it ends up being. May be .055, may be .035... wherever it runs the best.
The wider the gap you can run the better it will fire off more reliably at idle and keep emissions the lowest. But this means you need a good coil, wires, cap and rotor.
On a turbo, you have to gap for least dropout (misfire) under boost, in some cases this is as small as .015"
Gap by bending the ground electrode at the base---ideally you would use a gapping tool which keeps the gap even by keeping the strap parallell to the surface of the center electrode tip... but who has one of those besides me? (Had to gap 96 plugs really quick. I would gap them in sets of 500 each, so yeah, I bought a mechanical gapper!)
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What you have coming to your house is 240/220. This is split in your panel with some busbars that hook to your circuit breakers. 110V breakers feed off ONE busbar and a Neutral, while the 220V breakers feed off BOTH bussbars, with another line in there for ground.
If you feed 110V to a plug in your house, you feed HALF the box with power. And this means HALF of any 220V appliance will have power, the other will be a 'dead leg'. If you feed with the 240 socket, you will backfeed to both your bussbars, and power everything equally just like the power company. So yes, all the generator power will go into the panel. Making a balanced load will be up to you...
As stated above, the service disconnect must be opened as you can backfeed the grid. Myself, I have service disconnect, a power panel separate, and a meter I can pull. Pulling the meter takes you off the grid totally (with the above caveats about breaking seals, etc...)
If you use the 240 Plug (and that is the only way using a plug would work even somewhat safely) then the 110V plug will not be needed. There is no guaranteed way with 110plugs to insure you feed to both bussbars, or in any event not do something bad electrically (I recall "synchronous buss connections and phase rotation checks" lectures now...)
Shut off ALL your breakers before connecting. Then turn them on one at a time as you need the circuits. I would not turn them all on unless you have a generator capable of all your needs. I personally would chack voltage with everything think you need to have running, as said above little generators are not the greatest on regulation sometimes.
Even an auto transfer switch can fail. For the effort, a manual transfer switch would be the way I went. I like to turn it over and know mechanically there is no way for it to stick in position (been there, seen that)...
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Tim, I could have gone the rest of my life without ever seeing that photo!
Gargh! That brought back memories. We used them for cleaning the accumulation out of landfill gas recovery pipes...
Imagine that smell. It comes back to me now. It came back when I saw that photo, as well. Eeeych!
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Lots of misinformation here regarding what the C-Production Morton/BRE car was...
I can assure you it is not "really close to stock".
If you are wanting a REAL EXACT replica, plan on spending between $32 to $50K on the vehicle. Chassis prep with a full cage and seam welding will run close to $10K alone (JohnC's Beta Motorsports can do that work for you in SoCal, as well as the Fabricator that did Ron Carter's car)
Interior? White Paint over a gutted interior, with a matte-black dash that is all-business...
Figure the engine will run you another $10 to 15K. This L24 would be making around 325 at the crankshaft, at around 7500-8000 rpms. You are talking lift in the area of .620", and duration at .050 nearing 290...
Transmission? Direct Drive five speed from Nissan Competition---"A" Box.
It goes on from there.
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My meter has no seal on it. They forgot. They left 6 seals laying on the top of the panel...they disapeared.
Did I mention I have a lead seal crimper?
I pull my meter on a regular basis because of some stuff I have to do with the busbars in the service panel separate from my house. The service to that panel is 250A, but each branch circuit is less, house, shop, shed.
Connecting the main feeds to each requires I pull the meter. I like a totally dead circuit when doing those busbar kind of connections.
I might go with a DRYER outlet backfeeding the house with the service disconnect breaker in the panel being opened. With appropriate S/O 4 Cord.
But I would not backfeed 110 to a 15A plug. No way, no how!
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You should enter it in the ECTA Street Classes at Maxton. A LOT closer, and you can get a lot of the Technical Qualifications, License Requirements, and handling quirks ironed out there. Same classes at Bonneville run at Maxton (NC). Not that far a drive from VA. Head down the interstate, make a right at Lumberton, and just before you get to Laurinburgh NC, exit by the airport.
If you haven't run up at Bonneville before, do a lot of your preliminaries locally---you will go a lot faster, and things will go much smoother that way.
Sucks to drive 2800 miles and then get hosed on a $300 entry fee because of some technical issue that could have been found under repeated scruitineering at local events for a couple of years beforehand.
The days of "Burt Munroe" are long past due to liability and the speeds reached.
Good Luck on the project---give your timeframe, our ZXT project should be up there around the same time. But first these 2 Liter N/A records have to fall.... LOL
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Like Steve Allen on "To tell the Truth", I had to withdraw myself from the competition because of familiarity with the subject matter. The three pages were better than an answer right off anyway.
I'm glad someone WAG'd it and finally got it!
To be honest I was looking back becasue I wanted to spoil it after 24 hours or so anyway...LOL!
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He he he...1979.
But doesn't everyone know "The Fast and the Furious" started the "Turbo Nawws Import Trend"!
LOL
I have a Crown Setup... Same deal, but with an SU. Though I did pick up and 4-BBL Adapter.
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I keep telling you guys!
I was working when I was notified of it, I have everything needed to make that a runner, but I just want the bits! LOL
3 hours drive from me. Darn. Cheaper than my last 83 ZXT 2+2...which was $475, but that was delivered to my door.
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ohhhhhhh, not necessarily...
I had to wait a while, but I got mine for less than that.
They originally listed on E-Bay for $700! So as you can figure, I had to take the SDS the PO mated them with to get the ITB's (HKS units from the time of Wangan Midnight...) so it was more than 700, but less than 2500. They show up from time to time.
You can also gut the carbs and use them as ITB's, using the crossbar as the mounting source for the TPS on the EFI system...
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there was a local guy selling a RHD Fairlady... The car is a project though, needs restoration.
Send that information to me...
Also, send that manifold to me, I can put it on one of the Fairlady Z's I have already (and always have room for one more Fairlady!)
Actually, now that I'm thinking about it, greenmonster is sourcing the inlet for my HKS Type 2 Surge Tank, and this manifold would make for an interesting "period piece" installation in my 75 Fairlady Z.
Maybe I could paint it blue and get one of those old Trust 125mm S30 Exhaust Systems....
Anybody got some old Speed Shop Sinohara (SSS) decals laying around?????
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i was looking to replicate the Devil Z wangan monster! lol. well not exactly cause i do not want to deal with tripple carbs.
Watch you Wangan Closer. After the first revelation, the car sprouts ITB's and Additional Injectors. The Triple Carbs were only in the very first portion of the Series. It was converted very quickly (if you watch closely) later on to running EFI with ITB's (TWM Style Weber Compatible Throttle Bodies)
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A WC won't fit - the input shaft is different.
You mean a 240mm Ford CLutch Disc doesn't work getting squeezed between a 240mm Nissan Clutch and Cover? Or putting a Ford Spline into a Datsun Center Section is impossible?
This is HybridZ, let's not get World-Clasist! (bad pun)
What is the problem with the input shaft---is it too long? As I know the Tremec TKO had a different bushing size, and Ford Spline, but hey, that was a quick bit of work with the lathe, and requesting the clutch people to give it up for a Datsun Disc with a Ford Spline in the center. Now welding the ears on the T5 Bellhousing to mate with the TKO Mounting Ears was probably a bit over the top for most people... but if the input shaft was say 1" too long, a 1" spacer between the bellhousing and Tranny would take that into account to make it work (and is easier than welding damn ears on a bellhousing to boot!), soooo...
As long as the input shaft splines are in the same general area as the disc (bellhousing depth) it's fairly easy to make the little things work. Anything out back is standard swap kind of fabrication.
So I'm curious, what exactly makes the WC T5 incompatible?
Personally I think the G-Force Retrofit is the way to go, but what is the deal on the WCT5?
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To cover both the looks and function aspects of my build, I plan on making a detachable front nose piece (ala the old Dodge Charger Daytona) for my Z. When I am just cruising around, no nose piece. When I hit the salt flats, nose goes on.
When do you plan on going to the Salt? We should coordinate and share pit space. You planning on running MS (Modified Sports) class with the S30 Coupe?
Yeah, as above, the ZBoy post on ZC.C has a bunch of HP/Speed Comparos. 385 or thereabouts sounds right for a non-G-Nosed car at that speed.
building a turbo header w/ sched 40 weld pipe
in Fabrication / Welding
Posted
Are we talking the difference between Sch40 Mild Steel, and Sch10 Stainless?
The stainless photos look like Sch10, which I have seen used before on headers, and form my understanding is about the same cost as Sch40 mild, but can be welded with less heat, and weighs slightly less.
Just clarifying.