BLOZ UP Posted December 13, 2011 Share Posted December 13, 2011 Ok, it's true that the new thermostat could be bad, but unlikely. Just judging from the temperature of the radiator pipes I'll guess that it works well enough. What I'm trying to get answers for is whether it's really that big of a deal to take so long to warm up. Where warmup is how long it takes the CHTS to read... doh.... wait a second.... let me try another CHTS. Ok, maybe bjhines was right.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjhines Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 I'm reading the post and wondering why half your data is Celcius and the rest in Farenheit... among other things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantom Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 This thread is absolutely hilarious. The original problem is so obviously a malfunctioning thermostat it almost has me in tears. Thanks guys. I needed a good chuckle before I went to bed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLOZ UP Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 Apparently I missed something, I thought it was a simple question, unrelated to thermostats... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony D Posted December 17, 2011 Share Posted December 17, 2011 The "obviously malfunctioning thermostat" is overstressing it... If someone has drilled that 2mm bleed hole into the 160 thermostat, doesn't have the back of the block bypass line utilising only the internal block recirculation line and has efficient combustion with low thermal load.... That little 2mm burp hole just may vermouth to keep the engine from warming up. I don't see appreciable flow my radiator at cold startup idle. Sure, a thermostat held open when ALL the bypass lines are recirculating to the pump inlet to warm the engine might not warm up. Bit cap those bypasses and only keep the internal 8-10mm line and maybe one through the turbo? Perfectly sealed thermostat with that 2mm hole may make warmup at idle speed quite difficult indeed. But the solution is obvious: test Yhe thermostat see if it works/seals... If it does, come back, report, and boisterously gloat with satisfaction ad the experts get upset and tell you that you must be missing something else...or that it's just plain impossible! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xnke Posted December 17, 2011 Author Share Posted December 17, 2011 Sorry to say, Phantom, but the thermostat I removed behaves perfectly. I have a 1.76mm hole drilled in it (the drill bit was handy) and it will be sitting on the shelf in a labeled box until it is needed or the problem is solved. I am currently running a 180F thermostat, and the problem is somewhat alleviated; although my cabin heat is still quite lacking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony D Posted December 17, 2011 Share Posted December 17, 2011 "Low Thermal Input"---this is VERY common in Diesel Trucks as well. During the winter they literally have to block the radiator as ANY circulation outside the block itself will result in the engine running stone cold. If you only have the stock gauge it will not look like you aren't up to temperature. But reading a megasquirt datalog or megatune, you see you are exactly 143.7F (or whatever C) and start asking 'why'... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnc Posted December 17, 2011 Share Posted December 17, 2011 That little 2mm burp hole just may vermouth to keep the engine from warming up. I don't see appreciable flow my radiator at cold startup idle. A little too many Gin and Tonics Tony? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantom Posted December 18, 2011 Share Posted December 18, 2011 XNKE - sorry about being a bit "fresh". I've been round & round on engine temp issues many times and sometimes it gets to me. Slow warmup and then marginal overheating when driven harder is normally a sign of a thermostat that is stuck partially open. I had a similar problem with my LS1 except fot the "got too hot" part. It turned out that the radiator shop that had repaired my radiator had left some solder in the radiator and it ended up in my thermostat causing it to not close fully. The beast ran so cold that I was getting condensate in my oil. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony D Posted December 18, 2011 Share Posted December 18, 2011 Gotta love autocorrect on the iPhone, eh? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MidnightRider Posted December 19, 2011 Share Posted December 19, 2011 Had this same problem last week, bad sender. This week I had no oil pressure... I wasn't as lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony D Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 (edited) I want to address something about the "obviousness" of the problem. Water is not the ONLY method to cool the engine. Oil as well as air contribute to this. An example of this is the Caddy V8 that runs up to 55mph on NO WATER COOLING by simply shutting off one bank of cylinders, and alternating banks. What function does the thermostat play there? I recently rented a Ford Escape, idling in my brothers driveway at 41F with the heater on, no appreciable heat was produced. Putting the car in drive and driving to the end of the block after it had idled for over 25 minutes got the heater pumping out heat like crazy. Be open to the fact that an engine at idle may well not put enough BTU load into the cooling SYSTEMS of the engine that the WATER system may not warm to operational level due to the simple fact that radiation from the block to the air, and from the oil to the air from the pan may be enough to cause this to happen. When Lycoming PE150's were operated at -65F in Alaska their air cooling baffles were completely closed. Our diesels there NEVER got to operational temperature unless under nearly full load. Heat in the jeep cabins was only possible if you covered BOTH sides of the radiator with sheetmetal or cardboard! It is possible. If radiation losses are more than heat input ... You don't warm up! Edited December 21, 2011 by Tony D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony D Posted December 21, 2011 Share Posted December 21, 2011 Mobile version doesn't have edit, either... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjhines Posted December 21, 2011 Share Posted December 21, 2011 (edited) If only.... everything could be soooooo incredibly rare and complex as Tony makes it out to be. I have tackled some bitchin problems with my newest track toy, But this over complexificatation of freshman, newbie, neophytical problems is maddening. Tony wastes more neurons and electrons than anyone else allowed to post on this forum. Edited December 21, 2011 by bjhines Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony D Posted December 21, 2011 Share Posted December 21, 2011 B.J. I don't know what you're driving at, but: "If radiation losses are more than heat input ... You don't warm up! " This is simple thermodynamics. Please enlighten me as to your exemption from the physical laws so we all may have benefit of it! This is not rare, nor complex. It is very simple. It's so simple, many overlook it. Perhaps you have, living in a perpetually warm climate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
letitsnow Posted December 21, 2011 Share Posted December 21, 2011 I doubt that his radiation losses are greater than most typical cars. Mine comes up to temp just fine in 20*F weather. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony D Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 You have the exact same fueling conditions as he does? You can parse it to a single component if you wish... I wouldn't do that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony D Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 Nice edit BJ. I can see this is another exhaust manifold issue for you, cut and dried and no consideration for any other possibility...so you win. It's his thermostat, the one he tested as suggested and found good. It must be magic in that case... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xnke Posted December 22, 2011 Author Share Posted December 22, 2011 Moving to the 180F thermostat has improved the problem; but it wasn't until I blocked off about half of the radiator that i was able to get the car to MAINTAIN a temperature of 180F while driving at 70MPH on the highway. Cardboard FTW! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackdogNY Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 I have seen it in rare situations, but could the thermostat be installed upside-down? Also there might be a air pocket/blockage somewhere in the engine. Both unlikely but possible. I might be new here but it's weird that some people like to complain about a post for being boring or to easy to bother with but will still waste the same amount of time to whine as to actully try to help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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