swtjames23 Posted October 8, 2014 Share Posted October 8, 2014 Hey guys, been lurking/learning for a little while from old threads, thanks to all of you for all the great info I've used already. This is my first post because I can't seem to find anyone with the same problem. The car is my first Z and is a '73 240Z with a 400 sbc (stock w/ headers) and a Saginaw 4 speed. I took the car for a short drive one night, parked it, came out the next morning and it won't start. When I turn the key to "start" the starter bendix gear engages the flywheel but does not turn. When I jump the starter solenoid to the short post, same thing happens. When I jump it to the long post, nothing happens. From what I've read, when I jumped the solenoid to the "long" post, the starter should have turned, right? Also, when it fails to start, a relay clicks and won't reset until I disconnect the negative battery cable and reconnect. Is this normal? I'd like to be sure the starter is the problem, I'll have to unbolt the motor, jack it up, take off the header and spark plugs and remove the starter solenoid from the starter before it will come out. Thanks,James Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ritrebor Posted October 8, 2014 Share Posted October 8, 2014 You should just be able to jack the front of the car up and remove the 2 bolts that attach the starter assembly to the block. Then take the assembly to the parts store and they will test it for you. If it's bad I would just change the whole assembly. ritrebor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swtjames23 Posted October 8, 2014 Author Share Posted October 8, 2014 Right?! I should be able to but I can't. Starter won't come out with the header in place, header won't come out with the motor in place. Trust me, I've stared at it for hours. Is there any way to be absolutely sure that the starter is the problem without removing it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beermanpete Posted October 9, 2014 Share Posted October 9, 2014 (edited) From what you said it seems very likely the starter is bad. About the only thing more you can do is measure the voltage at the starter to make sure the connections are good. Connect a voltmeter across the starter, meaning the black lead on the starter housing (ground) and the red lead on the lower large lug on the solenoid (not the one with the battery cable attached). When everyrthing is off the voltage should be 0. When cranking the voltage should be about 9 or 10 depending on the condition of the battery. If the voltage is 12 when trying to crank but the starter is not turning the starter is bad. If the voltage falls to 0 or perhaps 1 or 2 volts but the starter does not turn you probably have a bad battery or a bad connection or bad cable. Edited October 9, 2014 by beermanpete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swtjames23 Posted October 9, 2014 Author Share Posted October 9, 2014 Ok thanks Pete, I'll try that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swtjames23 Posted October 12, 2014 Author Share Posted October 12, 2014 So, I had the starter tested and it works fine. Now I'm really stumped. I'm going to replace it with a new mini starter anyhow because it's such a chore to get to but what else should I be checking? Ignition? Are there relays somewhere that may have gone bad? I apologize for the ignorance, I'm brand new to small blocks and to Z cars. Thanks for your time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony D Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 Make sure the thing is shimmed correctly so as not to bind. That is the first thing I though reading your post. Chevy starters are NOT and no never have been "bolt on" there are starter shims to move them off the machined mounting pad to get proper engagement, other the Bendix drive jams in place, won't release, etc... Shims are as near as a coke can...that's what we cut them out of, or you can buy official precut parts to make the pinion engage the flywheel properly and release... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swtjames23 Posted October 27, 2014 Author Share Posted October 27, 2014 Ok, so the problem is not fixed. I've replace the starter and still no-go. When I turn the key, the starter gets power but only for a split second and then a relay on the firewall clicks and I lose all power. Same thing happens if I jump the solenoid directly to the starter. In order to restore power, I have to remove the ground from the battery and put it back on. Does this make sense to anyone? I could really use some more advice. Thanks, James Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redwine automotive Posted October 27, 2014 Share Posted October 27, 2014 Sounds like you are loosing main battery power or ground. check both cables very well . turn on head lights after trying to start and see if they work, if not try moving moving both cables around. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swtjames23 Posted October 28, 2014 Author Share Posted October 28, 2014 Headlights don't work after trying to start. Something trips when I try to crank, then if i wait for 30 seconds or so.. Or if i break the ground connection and reconnect it, power comes back on. This is so weird. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redwine automotive Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 If it resets every 30 sec you might have a circut breaker.Maybe installed when it was hybrid,look for changes in the harness. Do you still have a fuse link wire at starter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewZed Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 Sounds a whole lot like a bad battery cable connection. One of the big wire connections. Loose/dirty/corroded, the resistance from the current pulled to turn the starter motor heats up the connection and it opens. Cool down and the connection comes back. It's actually pretty common, it almost got me a year ago. If you have the bolt-on on cable ends, check those, also the typical post/connector interface. The clicking relay is probably coincidental to the power loss when the connection opens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redwine automotive Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 Yes it does, with headlights on pull and twist battery cables,when lights come on you found your problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swtjames23 Posted October 28, 2014 Author Share Posted October 28, 2014 Problem solved! Thanks to everyone for all the great ideas. It was, in fact, the negative battery connection. It has those cheap clamp on connectors with the two bolts to clamp the cable to the connector, it was all corroded under there. Good call Redwine and NewZed and thanks to everyone else for the ideas. Can I solder the cable to these cheap bolt-on connectors? Or do I need to buy different connectors? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redwine automotive Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 you can not solder the cast ones but you can get crimp on kind that can be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jhm Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 Cool....I was wondering where the heck to get info on Levitra! Thank god for spammers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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