Ben280 Posted February 6, 2017 Share Posted February 6, 2017 Little about my setup for background, and those not familiar with my build. MS3.57 with the MS3x board for heaps of outputs. OER 45mm ITB's, Kameari intake, high comp Rebello engine. My new (to me) header is a Pace Setter 3-2 style that has 2 O2 sensor bungs right before the merge meaning I can pick a side and run 1 sensor, OR get all fancy and run 2, keeping track on 1/2/3 OR 4/5/6. I'm on more of a budget now than I used to be, and I'm wondering if anybody can help me justify running dual widebands, rather than a single. I'm thinking it would be helpful to keep tabs on all the cylinders, sort of a "more you know" philosophy, particularly if the ITB's start to drift out of trim. I'm also thinking that the ITB's shouldn't drift too much since everything is running off the megasquirt, rather than trying to line up a bunch of carbs. Input and experience appreciated! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ryant67 Posted February 6, 2017 Share Posted February 6, 2017 Not sure about the benefits, other than being able to see two halves instead of one whole. With old carbs that might be somewhat useful when troubleshooting issues and balancing, but as you said, with new ITB's that are in spec and controlled by a reliable ECU it would likely be overkill. If it were me, I'd probably just plug both of the existing 02 bungs, and place one further down the line after the marge and call it a day... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madkaw Posted February 6, 2017 Share Posted February 6, 2017 (edited) I've thought of going the same route , but I run dual pipes. Pros: redundancy - sensors do go bad , this would be a back up. Troubleshooting - one more tool Tuning- what if you want to run 5&6 a bit richer based on detonation issues - separate sensors would help verify More gauges in the cockpit to impress friends !! Cons - more money and more wiring Edited February 6, 2017 by madkaw Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacky4566 Posted February 6, 2017 Share Posted February 6, 2017 A spartan2 is only $125.00 so If you have an MS3x then another sensor is relatively cheap add. If you are wanting to ek out more power then go for it. Could also be used to get high lean conditions when cruising for fuel economy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seattlejester Posted February 6, 2017 Share Posted February 6, 2017 If it was carbeurated and you could get the paired cylinders then it might be useful to tune the carbs. For EFI it depends on your fuel control. I think my MS3.57 only has two channels for fuel although I don't recall if you can run them independently. I seem to recall a setting like that for things like V engines or dual injectors so it may be available. So if you did split the channels for 123, 456 then you could basically monitor the fuel and trim the fuel and treat the car like it has two 3 cylinders in regards to fuel. Downfall would be if you wanted the most out of it you would have to look at two logs and tune two maps basically, then run two O2 sensors. If you wanted to keep track of them that would also be two wideband o2 gauges as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madkaw Posted February 7, 2017 Share Posted February 7, 2017 How are you liking those OERs ? You have a thread on that install? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben280 Posted February 7, 2017 Author Share Posted February 7, 2017 Lots of good ideas in here guys, thanks! Money and wires are definitely issues to concern myself with. I've got a PLX SM-AFR and an Innovative LC-2 at my disposal, just need to decide if the data I can get is something I'll use, or if it's a case of "more for more's sake". Jacky4566- Was looking at the Spartan 2's they seem like a great deal, particularly when you don't need anything crazy! Wish I saw them before I bought my LC-2 last year =( Not a street car anymore, so frankly, fuel economy is the last thing on my mind, but full lean conditions tend to yield the most power. They are best before they blow philosophy. Seattlejester- with the MS3X I get 8 injector and coil drivers, so if I had a cam signal I could run full sequential. As is I just have crank trigger signal so I have to run batch fire and wasted spark. The MS3x board has an input for a 2nd wideband as well, so I can look at a single log for everything! Madkaw- the OERs are pretty nice so far, I'm updating my build thread with the past 6 months of progress, including ITB setup! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chickenman Posted February 7, 2017 Share Posted February 7, 2017 Instead of multiple O 2 sensors you could use electronic Pyro's in each exhausts header. Much easier to hook up with auxilary inputs in a stand alone than WB controllers. Most Dyno shops have test headers for engines with individual Pyro's. Nascar, WEC and F1 engines all are tested with individual Pyro's per exhaust port. I've seen video's of Renault V8 and V10 F1 engines on the Dyno, and they only used 1 WB O2 sensor per bank, FWIW These days F1 engines are using Turbulent Jet Ignition. Big hush hush stuff. Main reason why Mercedes has had such a dominant engine the last few years. http://www.enginelabs.com/news/f1-tech-what-is-turbulent-jet-ignition/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seattlejester Posted February 7, 2017 Share Posted February 7, 2017 Oh gotcha, I didn't realize you had the MS3x, the 3.57 board usually made me think MS2. You do have ITB's so you could run per cylinder tuning if you wanted to go insane, but that would require even more o2 sensors. Honestly even two seems overkill to be realistic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben280 Posted February 8, 2017 Author Share Posted February 8, 2017 Chickenman, good call with the pyros! That's on the list for sure, but it is a pretty expensive piece of kit to add. Good reminder, and easy to hook up through CANBUS. I'm going into the dyno in a week, I'll keep everybody posted with what happens, and if the tuner has opinions! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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