SBC starting problems

[Jaconense777]

Hello guys again,  I try to post but it created like about 3 post and can’t see the content, I apologize for that. Question number 1: can I change the brake vacuum reservoir hoses without compromising air getting in to the brakes fluids? 

It has edelbrock 60739 heads,1406 carb, performer 2101 manifold for reference.

Hello guys again, Question number 1: can I change the brake vacuum reservoir hoses without compromising air getting in to the brakes fluids? 

It has edelbrock 60739 heads,1406 carb, performer 2101 manifold for reference.

 

 

Question 2.
I have a problem with my car it cranks but it doesn’t start. it has new ngk spark plugs (got them at Amazon) it was backfiring and saw some smoke coming out by the headers so I changed the valves covers and headers gaskets, new battery, the fuel pump is a red Holley and it sounds that it’s working (as it’s very loud) I cleaned the fuel hoses with air pressure . used starting fluid and it just cranks but it doesn’t start. I was told that it could be the started but as it cranks I searched up and found out that if it cranks the starter works.what ever it’s going on it’s drying out the battery, I had some alarm expert lol from a local alarm shop near my place and paid a lot because they had to remove the old alarm system and put a new one, the old one stopped working and i couldn’t turn it off, and it was working fine before, even he broke my steering wheel column cover. but all this thing happened when all the crazy stuff about the pandemic and couldn’t get in touch with them, so I am screwed there. 
Anyway I narrow things down, The fuel pump is loud and there is fuel in the carburetor, I bought a performance tool w86553 Ignition Tester and there’s no power on the spark plug tester, I checked on 3 spark plug cables, so I was looking at the hatch connector and shows some rust I cleaned but still doesn’t work, Should I buy a new distributor ? If so which one do you recommend?  
The car was turning on without a problem, I twisted the distributor a little to the left (counterclockwise) and turned back as I saw some antifreeze by the left rear bolt next to the distributor so I don’t know if that could be one of the reasons. I didn’t know that affects the timing.I am categorized as disabled, and been working on my Z, Had to deal with cancer and had something like a stroke and had to remember or relearn some stuff, spend over a year down and 6 months in the hospital so no much $ and my oldest son is helping me with the hard work.c found the spark plugs about $5 bucks cheaper  on amazon and that’s why I bought them In case some one ask why I bought them on Amazon 😅lol

 

 

Do you guy have any idea what it could be?

[Michael]

Jaconense, first, welcome to the Forum.  Second, before proceeding to the main response, a word on philosophy.  It sounds like you recently acquired a fairly well-built but slightly ailing V8 Z.  It also sounds like the previous owner got it to run, sold it to you, and then various travails manifested themselves.  Correct?  From the various pictures, your purchase looks to be fundamentally sound - assuming that the price was appropriate.  So, please pause to congratulate yourself on what at least on first blush appears to be a decent baseline.

 

Now moving on to your specific question.  1-8-4-3-6-5-7-2.  This is the canonical Chevy firing-order.  Check that yours follows that.  I've often made the mistake of confusing the wires, and wondering why the engine runs poorly.  If enough wires are crossed, it won't fire at all, even with starting fluid.  And speaking of starting-fluid, if there isn't even the faintest gasp, despite said fluid, then almost certainly the problem is ignition related.  Pull a spark plug, reattach its respective wire, hold the arm of the electrode to ground (like a cylinder head), have a friend crank the engine, and watch for spark.  If you have no spark, there's the problem right there.  If there is a spark, we move to the next culprit.

 

Try the aforementioned (check firing order, and check for spark from a pulled plug), and report back to us.  Good luck!

[NewZed]

On 7/3/2020 at 8:03 PM, Jaconense777 said:

Anyway I narrow things down, The fuel pump is loud and there is fuel in the carburetor, I bought a performance tool w86553 Ignition Tester and there’s no power on the spark plug tester, I checked on 3 spark plug cables, so I was looking at the hatch connector and shows some rust I cleaned but still doesn’t work, Should I buy a new distributor ? If so which one do you recommend?  

 

From your picture it looks like you have an HEI distributor.  The ignition module and coil are under the cap.  They are known to go bad at times.  Since you don't have spark, and it looks like you have the right tool for checking spark, I would make sure that the distributor and ignition module have power, using a meter.  If they do then changing the module would be a simple and cheap thing to do, with good odds.  Firing order doesn't matter if there's no spark (no offense Michael, he said that he checked for spark).  

 

Here is the tool that was mentioned.  And a Google link to some results on how to work with an HEI distributor.  Some good videos.  That is probably where your problem is.  Ignition modules are sensitive to stray sparks and heat.

 

https://www.amazon.com/Performance-Tool-W86553-Ignition-Tester/dp/B003WZXAWK

 

https://www.google.com/search?q=troubleshooting+hei&rlz=1C1SQJL_enUS862US862&oq=troubleshooting+hei&aqs=chrome..69i57.5454j0j8&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

[Jaconense777]

Sorry for the late reply. Thanks for the help, I am going to replace the tach and power connectors, do you think it could be better if I replace the whole distributor? Because I believe the distributor comes with the wires. And they cost around $20 to $30 on O’rellys or auto zone. If I remove the distributor cap (with the cables attached) how do I Know if there is any damage? Does this affect the distributor in any way?. Also can I replace the brake vacuum reservoir hoses without compromising air getting in to the brakes fluids? Thanks for the help.

[Miles]

7 hours ago, Jaconense777 said:

Sorry for the late reply. Thanks for the help, I am going to replace the tach and power connectors, do you think it could be better if I replace the whole distributor?  Not unless you think that the distributor is defective.

 

Because I believe the distributor comes with the wires. And they cost around $20 to $30 on O’rellys or auto zone. If I remove the distributor cap (with the cables attached) how do I Know if there is any damage?  You can inspect the cap for cracks or electrical arching and check that the contact in the center is not worn/broken. You can look up the resistance specs for your wires and then check the resistance of each wire with a multi meter.  A decent set of wires will run you about $100.

 

Does this affect the distributor in any way?.  ??

 

Also can I replace the brake vacuum reservoir hoses without compromising air getting in to the brakes fluids?  I assume you are talking about the vacuum hose that goes from the base of the carb to the brake vacuum booster.  There is no fluid in the booster. If you need to work on or remove the the booster you do not have to remove the master cylinder (MC) or the hard brake lines. There is enough flex in the hard lines that you can remove the two nuts that hold the MC onto the booster and just pull the MC back out of the way leaving the hard lines connected. Note: don't touch the push rod that connects the booster to the MC piston. If you pull that push rod out too far the reaction disk will fall into the booster and you will very sad. Look up reaction disk for more info.

 

 

Quote

 

Thanks for the help.

 

Edited July 8, 2020 by Miles

[Michael]

Distributor choices are legion.  But they're rarely sold "with" the wires.  Replacing the distributor should be a last-resort, as there's a trick to getting it properly reinstalled...namely aligning the tang at the bottom of the distributor shaft, with corresponding receptacle on the camshaft.  This is simplified if the #1 piston is brought to TDC on the intake stroke, before the distributor is disturbed.

 

In any case, it's not yet clear to me, that it was determined that there is no spark at all.  But if it is indeed the case, that there is no spark, then my first hunch would be something with the HEI coil (inside of the HEI distributor cap) or the connectors thereto... or possibly the HEI module.  HEI is a bit weird, in that the coil is actually inside of the cap.  Contrast that with the conventional setup, where the coil is a cylindrical piece (resembles a 12-oz aluminum can) typically hung from the firewall, with a high-tension wire from its apex, to the distributor.

 

This is the sort of diagnosis that is relatively straightforward for an old-hand (or so it's claimed!), but exasperatingly bewildering to some one who's unacquainted with the parts and lingo.  Best would be to find a local mentor, if for no other reason than to offer companionship and an additional pair of eyes.

[Jaconense777]

Thanks for all your support and your time, as time is something that we cannot get back anymore. I read your message Too late my friend 🤯🥴, I watched a couple of videos and they suggest to clean the inside of the distributor and the metal parts, So I did it as they suggested.so when I asked if there was any chance for the distributor to be affected in any how if the cap was removed, is because I was afraid of what just happened🤦🏻😅 Lol. I was cleaning The rotor as stated on one of the videos and it moved clockwise very easy. And looks like it was aligned with a mark that was painted on the module. And it was aligned in direction with the first spark plug. I was looking on some videos and shows that I need to manually turn the engine  sticking A finger on a spark plug hole but I don’t see how can I turn my engine. I might need to get professional help, something that I was trying to avoid as I am very short on cash, how could I align the rotor with that line again? I probably need to move it counterclockwise, but how?
 I found the power cord very loose, so I already ordered online and I am going to replace it. Please guys safe my life here 😆 LoL. This is one of the videos I watched 

 

also this is the hose I am going to replace, so there are no consequences if removed? Sorry sometimes stupid questions prevents stupid results.thanks for your patience.

Edited July 9, 2020 by Jaconense777

[NewZed]

You need to confirm that you have power.  You can waste a lot of time if you don't use a meter or test light when dealing with electrical problems.  Cleaning stuff is what you do when you're stuck in the desert with no tools.  

 

https://www.google.com/search?q=how+to+use+a+multimeter&rlz=1C1SQJL_enUS862US862&oq=how+to+use+a+multimeter&aqs=chrome..69i57.4862j0j8&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

[Jaconense777]

20 hours ago, NewZed said:

You need to confirm that you have power.  You can waste a lot of time if you don't use a meter or test light when dealing with electrical problems.  Cleaning stuff is what you do when you're stuck in the desert with no tools.  

 

https://www.google.com/search?q=how+to+use+a+multimeter&rlz=1C1SQJL_enUS862US862&oq=how+to+use+a+multimeter&aqs=chrome..69i57.4862j0j8&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

Thanks i already have an idea of how to use an multimeter, I used to build RC cars and that video gave me an reminder of how To properly use it, I already had ordered the multimeter and the power and tach wires And will come by mail by tomorrow. Ill test the cables, distributor cap and I’ll be back with any updates. 
thanks again.

[jhm]

Very likely the distributor is not in the correct position, especially if you've already removed it at least once.  Fortunately, it's easy to reinstall it to the correct position.  Others above have described the correct procedure, but you may be better off googling some Youtube videos on "how to install your distributor into SBC".  (You can turn the engine over during this procedure with a large ratchet on the main shaft bolt....it's the big v-belt pulley on the front bottom of your engine.)

 

Don't spend any more of your money on new parts until you've done some additional diagnosis.

[NewZed]

On 7/3/2020 at 8:03 PM, Jaconense777 said:

bought a performance tool w86553 Ignition Tester and there’s no power on the spark plug tester, I checked on 3 spark plug cables,

 

I don't want to pick on the random guesses but the poster says that there's no spark.  We can all really only go by what is written.  If there's no spark then distributor position won't matter.  

 

Could be that he's using the tester incorrectly, or has forgotten how to use his meter.  But, when working with electrical things, one of the very first things a person usually does is to check that the electrical thing is getting electricity.  It needs it to function.

[jhm]

On 7/3/2020 at 11:03 PM, Jaconense777 said:

it was backfiring

 

I'm thinking that *something* is happening ignition-wise here.  

 

Hard to tell for sure from the multiple posts covering multiple issues.

[Twisted46]

I had a hell of a time getting my SBC V1.0 started on my first go around, replaced just about everything external to the engine with new stuff. Turns out it was way too retarded and any attempt to start failed or resulted in a backfire. Here is what I finally did and suggest that you do as well. 

-Remove #1 spark plug and valve cover (removing the timing cover is preferred but not easy)

-Find top dead center of the compression stroke via methods already discussed (align crank and cam dots if you have the cover off, more accurate)

-Take note of the position of your harmonic balancer "zero" line and mark it on the timing cover (I use paint marker)

-Line up the rotor with #1 spark plug pole on the cap

-disconnect vacuum advance 

-Rotate the distributor 15-20 degrees counterclockwise (if you have a clear cap this is very easy, I usually set mine so the rotor is resting just before the leading edge of the cap pole)

 

It should fire right off, I use this method now every time I have to resent timing for various reasons and it works without fail. Now this is only a starting point and you will yield too much advance to most distributors but makes for easy first starts if you are doing a new engine break in. What I have learned is that it takes a pretty serious carb or intake issue for the car not to start AT ALL, running poorly is a different issue. 

If it still won't fire run a wire directly from the battery positive to the distributor 12v terminal and check your ground connections, the problems a bad ground can cause are immense and frustrating. 

Edited July 18, 2020 by Twisted46