sims76 Posted October 20, 2005 Share Posted October 20, 2005 I'm getting married in two weeks.... My future wife works at a four person company. There are two owners, her, and another employee. They allow 2 weeks paid vacation per year. We are going to Hawaii on the honeymoon immediately after the wedding and she will take her full two weeks vacation then. Their "year" for vacation time just started last month, so she has the full two weeks right now, they don't go by calendar year. The problem is that her best friend is also getting married in January and she is the maid of honor so we will be taking two days off in January to travel to Key West to participate in the wedding. The owners basically told her today that she should not plan on going and that this would likely lead to her termination if she missed this work (even if she took unpaid vacation.) We both feel that these are once in a lifetime events that are very important. Therefore, we have every intention of going to Key West as planned. How would you approach this? Be humble and ask them to understand? Quit? Pretend like your not going then go anyway? Keep calling in sick until they actually just fire you? Extra Info: We can to afford to not have her work for an extended period. She would much rather work than be unemployed and is not a quitter. For the past 18 months since she started, they have been telling her that they need some time to see how the situation is "working out." This is a professional firm, and her work and attitude is very good. The attitude of the owners is generally very condescending. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AgentZ Posted October 20, 2005 Share Posted October 20, 2005 Screw em. I have had it up to my *** with employers who are all high and mighty. Honestly in a 4 person company her leaving would most likley cost them a wee bit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ULISES Posted October 20, 2005 Share Posted October 20, 2005 I would just take those two days off my wedding vacations! That would be the best thing to do,If it was me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moridin Posted October 20, 2005 Share Posted October 20, 2005 I'm getting married in two weeks.... My future wife works at a four person company. There are two owners' date=' her, and another employee. They allow 2 weeks paid vacation per year. We are going to Hawaii on the honeymoon immediately after the wedding and she will take her full two weeks vacation then. Their "year" for vacation time just started last month, so she has the full two weeks right now, they don't go by calendar year. The problem is that her best friend is also getting married in January and she is the maid of honor so we will be taking two days off in January to travel to Key West to participate in the wedding. The owners basically told her today that she should not plan on going and that this would likely lead to her termination if she missed this work (even if she took unpaid vacation.) We both feel that these are once in a lifetime events that are very important. Therefore, we have every intention of going to Key West as planned. How would you approach this? Be humble and ask them to understand? Quit? Pretend like your not going then go anyway? Keep calling in sick until they actually just fire you? Extra Info: We can to afford to not have her work for an extended period. She would much rather work than be unemployed and is not a quitter. For the past 18 months since she started, they have been telling her that they need some time to see how the situation is "working out." This is a professional firm, and her work and attitude is very good. The attitude of the owners is generally very condescending.[/quote'] If they value her as an employee, they would understand. Why would you want to work there otherwise? If her employers won't budge, find a better place to work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wheelman Posted October 20, 2005 Share Posted October 20, 2005 I agree with Moridin. Find another place to work but be professional about it and let them know why. Maybe they'll change thier tune when they see it's really important to her and allow your wife to take the time off without pay. If they are really uptight about it I'd find a different place to work, especailly if you can afford to not have her work for a while. Finding a new job is a full time job in itself so it's not like she'll just be sitting around doing nothing. Just my $.02 worth. Wheelman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zuhow Posted October 20, 2005 Share Posted October 20, 2005 I'm going through something similar. I just got married on the 8th. I asked if I could take some unpaid time off for my honeymoon because I've used all my (meager) vacation time up. they said they didn't think it would be a problem, that's before I told them that I want to take 5 weeks off. they were a little less understanding then. I suggested 2 times that would work for me an let them pick (nov or march). Eventually we settled on MArch and it seems all will be good. My advice is simple- just remeber that work is a component of your life and not that your life is a component of work. You'll be able to find another job (she will) hopefully you wont get married again! Try to be as accomadating as possile, but get what you want! and dont think twice about living your life!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikelly Posted October 20, 2005 Share Posted October 20, 2005 Here are things to consider... You don't work, and you don't get paid... The other side of that is your employer also loses productivity and if you are getting benefits provided to you (Healthcare, long and short term disability, 401K, retirement, Life insurance) then all that still needs to be paid while you (Or in her case SHE) are/is taking LWOP. LWOP doesnt' help anyone involved. Furthermore, I'm now an employer (As of this week) and I can tell you after looking at resumes all day the last three days, I'm not calling someone who has been fired or has a period of time in their resume where they appear to have been without work... I'm just not riniging the phone to ASK why... You don't even rate an interview, You following me? It absolutely sux to be an adult and have to work. It also sux to not be able to stay out on your own and pay your bills... I'd say shorten the vacation by two days, and take that two days when you need it for the trip to the keys... One last comment... If your soon to be wife was truly valued by her employer, she wouldn't still be on a "trial basis". And if she was truly valued, they'd have worked out two days for her to take LWOP down the road. So if everything else is as you exlpained it, then she should probably be looking for another employer anyway. Rule #1 to success... Your PEOPLE that you HIRE will make you a success or sink you... Treat them well, and you will (SHOULD) be rewarded. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dayz Posted October 20, 2005 Share Posted October 20, 2005 I agree to Mikelly on this one: Your PEOPLE that you HIRE will make you a success or sink you... Treat them well, and you will (SHOULD) be rewarded As an HR consultant myself, I think your employees are the most important ressouce for success. I don't know the industry she works in, but finding another employee that does the work well (as she probably does) is an Hard task and the cost that are involve are high. It cost in average 15 000$ to hire someone that you will like an will do the work. The probation period has been way too long, if she is not treated that well it might be time for a change. As an employer as well, I would understand that getting married IS a special thing, and she probably can do extra hours to compensate for those 2 days that she'd me missing. If I was in this situation, with the info that I know I would start looking somewhere else. As an employee you need the be rewarded as much as the owner but in a different way. From what I read, it looks like your wife likes the company more than the company likes her !! Being fired IS a bad thing, you never want to have bad relations with ex-employers, they might hire you again in the future. There must be a way to make everyone happy, if not the company doesn't reward her the way she needs to be !! Dayz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrandonsZ Posted October 20, 2005 Share Posted October 20, 2005 You have no obligation to go to the wedding, they'll understand that her employer is an ***, the honeymoon is more important. Tell her to look for another job, immediately. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr_hunt Posted October 20, 2005 Share Posted October 20, 2005 Fact is, Federal employment law prohibits them from firing her if she takes leave without pay. It is not "cause" to terminate someone for taking leave without pay. You self employed folks should know this. You just can't fire somebody without a paper trail of 3 written reprimands, 3 corrective action meetings and 3 signed documents where the guilty party acknowledges the wrong doing and the corrective action. If they did fire her, you could successfully sue the pants off of them for wrongfull termination. While I was the office manger at an engineering firm, I tried to fire this gal who never showed up on Monday's, left early on Friday's and always had some excuse. I finally caught her doing drafting side work on company time, company computer and canned the witch. If you don't do it by the book, some little twerp lawyer will stick it to you and you'll have to pay back pay, give them their job back or pay unemployment benefits until they get a new job, not to mention punative damages. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gollum Posted October 20, 2005 Share Posted October 20, 2005 ^ what the doc said. They have no real reason to fire her. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zuhow Posted October 20, 2005 Share Posted October 20, 2005 What doc said isn't true in MD. It's an "at will employment" state. Either party can terminate the employment for any (or no) reason at anytime. You can not fire someone for taking "family leave" or leave in some limted other circumstances, but you have no right to unpaid leave to go to a wedding or whatnot. My point is just that if they would fire her over 2 days, there isnt a strong relationship there and I would lose any sleep over ending it. Mike Kellys point is well taken that it's not good to get fired, so I say just be up front about it and decide if those 2 days are worth finding another job or if there is a possible work around that makes everybody happy enough. By all means, don't burn any bridges, as they say, be careful, the toes you step on today may be attached to the *** you have to kiss tomorrow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrSideways Posted October 20, 2005 Share Posted October 20, 2005 Hmmm....Since they now know about the whole schedule my approach wouldn't work. If it were me I would have been upfront about your own wedding and vacation time. Then I would have called in sick for the two days later. Done deal. Just make sure to use your cell phone to call from out of state or country. The caller ID wouldn't look good with a Key West tag on it. Alan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr_hunt Posted October 21, 2005 Share Posted October 21, 2005 NM is an at will state also unless you have an employment offer in writing or an employment contract. In my experience an employment offer was made in writing and accepted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest tony78_280z Posted October 21, 2005 Share Posted October 21, 2005 Two weeks to the day of the wedding, say "In two weeks time I will be in Key West." It can be considered either personal leave with notice, or quiting with notice. Either way your conscious should be clear, and that is truly what is at stake here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
240ZR Posted October 21, 2005 Share Posted October 21, 2005 meh I vote for burning the owners hoouse to the ground but thats just me..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pop N Wood Posted October 21, 2005 Share Posted October 21, 2005 See if you can work out a deal for comp time. Offer to work a few weekends before and after the key west date or maybe 10 hour days and see if the employer will go for it. Is there any chance of getting a temp for two days? Worst comes to worst, they can't fire you if you have already quit. Start circulating resumes now and see what the job market is like. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zerrari GTO Posted October 21, 2005 Share Posted October 21, 2005 Have your future wife start actively looking for work NOW. It is always easier to find a job when you have a job. If she has a solid track record with a good work history she should not have a problem finding employment before Jan. When she does get an offer she should explain about the two days needed in January and that she is obligated and plans have been made. She should explain to her current employers in a professional manner why she is leaving. If she does not find another job before your trip and you intend to go anyway; she should give two weeks notice before the trip with an explanation of why. You will be amazed at the reaction you get when a qualifed employee calls the bluff of an employer in a professional manner. Two extra days is no big deal and could be deducted from next years vacation time or pay could be deducted for the two days off. Her bosses sound like jerks and she would probably be better served by moving on anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
savageskaterkid Posted October 21, 2005 Share Posted October 21, 2005 Worst case scenerio, they say that if she leaves for the measly 2 days, then she'll get fired....wich seems a bit pathetic. If you know that this is gonna happen, get her to put in her 2 weeks notice the day b4 you go on your honeymoon, that way she will get the 2 weeks vacation that she earned, and if the employer relizes how bad it is w/o her while your on vacation, you can work out a negotiation. I almost quit one year when i took 2 weeks vacation, but i decided that i really needed the money to finish paying off the Z bill. I almost did it again this year, but I had noticed that if i quit one of my jobs that my income would severly decrease, and as of now, not even 2 jobs give me enough hours......im applying for a third. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sims76 Posted October 24, 2005 Author Share Posted October 24, 2005 Thanks for the responses guys, I read every one carefully and thought about them all. I think I'll also run this thread by her to give her some more encouragement and discuss some options that you mentioned that occurr to us. We have decided that it is best that she looks for another job right now. We think she should move on if possible without burning any bridges, because you just never know. When you take away this vacation issue, there is just a general lack of positive things to look forward to when she goes to this job every day. She has gotten a call already because she works in a very networked business and some people (and employers) that she used to work with/for are happy to give her good reccomendations and keep their ears open on her behalf. By the way, she works for a interior design firm outside of Philadelphia as an interior designer. The spaces they create are impressive, including the ones done by her firm. For lack of a better description, some of the most successful people in the business (including her bosses) can be the most egotistical. It makes for a good product if you're the customer, but not always a good working atmosphere as the employee. Thanks guys, we'll enjoy the honeymoon (leaving Monday for Hawaii) and our time in the Keys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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