cygnusx1 Posted November 10, 2009 Share Posted November 10, 2009 Little by little I have been training my left foot to use the brake pedal. I finally feel confident enough to use it hard, if I am not going for a gear change. Today I experimented with a series of tight third gear curves on a local road. I stayed in third and "left-right" punched my way through the chained curves using the technique. It seems to be a MUCH better way to get through a tight series of curves. The benefits I see, are many. I can get the nose to turn in by trail braking a little at entry I can hold in a bit of throttle to keep the turbo spooled I can transfer from braking to acelleration MUCH quicker after the apex. I have much tighter control of the front-rear weight transfer. Driveline slop is a non issue because you can keep the driveline pre-loaded a bit. Has anyone else played with this technique? It really gets the best out of the Z. I can make the car rotate through the corner by using balance between my left and right foot pressures. It's almost like being able to use front and rear independent hand brakes on a bicycle to control the skidding of a bike. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cfg240z Posted November 10, 2009 Share Posted November 10, 2009 I've started to play around with left foot braking...although mostly in the virtual world ...rfactor with a Logitec G25 to be specific. And it seems to really allow for nuanced control. I've tried in my Focus SVT...but power assist brakes...very touchy. Whereas with the 240z, I can see it being a bit more forgiving. I definitely heel and toe in every day driving...then again, I've been practicing for about 10 years. But I'm curious about using left foot braking a bit more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cygnusx1 Posted November 10, 2009 Author Share Posted November 10, 2009 Heel and toe has been in my bag of tricks since I got my drivers license 25 years ago. I had to keep the clunker from stalling while braking, and learned H&T as a result. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexicoker Posted November 10, 2009 Share Posted November 10, 2009 I had a dream last night that my Z had a sequential gearbox... I was left foot braking and just blipping to downshift. It was awesome! I become much faster at autoXing once I learned to left foot brake. Throttle lift will often upset the car, but you can scrub off speed and keep alot more control mid-turn or mid-slalom by left foot braking and keeping the throttle where its at. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMortensen Posted November 10, 2009 Share Posted November 10, 2009 I'm pretty much where you are at Dave. I was trying to do the left foot brake and then switch feet to downshift and found that damn near impossible under pressure. I could do it on the street pretty well, but on the track I think there was too much pedal pressure required. I was practicing on the street and luckily no one was behind me the day I SLAMMED the brakes when I hit the brake thinking it was the clutch pedal going for a shift. I never realized how hard I hit the clutch pedal until that moment, and actually it took me a while to realize it after that moment. I initially thought I had been in an accident or something. I was driving along, shifting to third and suddenly I was hard in the seatbelt. I laughed for quite a while after I realized what I had done though. After that experience it was left foot braking for autox and right foot for anything where downshifting was a consideration. You also have to figure that up until the late 90's or so Rubens Barichello was right foot braking in F1, so it's not like you can't be a fast right foot braker. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayolives Posted November 10, 2009 Share Posted November 10, 2009 Most better race car drivers are adept at left foot braking techniques. The benefits are many. However, there are some top notch professional drivers, Mark Martin comes to mind, that reportedly don't left foot brake. Most of us were taught to use the right foot from day one, and getting the other one trained takes a lot of practice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cygnusx1 Posted November 10, 2009 Author Share Posted November 10, 2009 If I could only learn to heel and toe the left foot with the brake and clutch I would be pedal-king. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EvilC Posted November 10, 2009 Share Posted November 10, 2009 I have to learn how to heel n toe. When is comes to left foot braking.....do many road course drivers do it? I hear often that guys who came from dirt racing series would use it often but not many road racers.....not sure how true that statement is. I am just trying to see the benifit of it while road racing - you would need to have very good brakes to keep up with constant trail braking right? I mean wouldn't that be the benifit of using your left foot, so your right foot can stay on the gas? Also does it work when you are on a course where you have to constantly be shifting say like a LimeRock? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMortensen Posted November 10, 2009 Share Posted November 10, 2009 If you look at a data log from a left foot braker and a right foot braker, you can see the gap from the time the right foot braker comes off the gas and switches to the brakes before every braking zone. The left foot braker has no gaps if they can do it well, and if it's 1/10th of a second every time that's 1/10th of a second that the left foot braker can stay on the gas a little longer. Back about 10 years ago they did this with Michael Schumacher and Rubens Barichello. They showed the data plots one on top of the other and explained where Rubens was losing time, and they said at the time that he was the last right foot braker in F1. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnc Posted November 10, 2009 Share Posted November 10, 2009 Left foot braking is a definite advantage in racing and driving on the street. I had a dream last night that my Z had a sequential gearbox... I was left foot braking and just blipping to downshift. It was awesome! If you're paying for the sequential transmission, you'll want to use the clutch on downshifts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xnke Posted November 10, 2009 Share Posted November 10, 2009 Ever since my IAC motor died in my old ford clunker, I've had to left foot brake just to keep the engine going if it's under about 50F out. Never even though about using it as a driving technique, other than that! Learn something new every 10 minutes, I guess. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lazeum Posted November 10, 2009 Share Posted November 10, 2009 I've always been impressed by video with on board videos to watch foot work Here's one of these, Group B drivers were nuts... Left foot braking is the only way I found not to be bored with AT cars also Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cygnusx1 Posted November 10, 2009 Author Share Posted November 10, 2009 Nice video. It's like playing an instrument. The instrument of speed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zmanco Posted November 10, 2009 Share Posted November 10, 2009 His foot work is amazing. I also noticed that there were times where he was just briefly tapping the brakes with his left foot. I suspect that if he only used his right foot, he might not move it over for those little taps. Not sure how to quantify it, but I suspect the overall benefit of left foot braking is BOTH the reduced reaction time (to move from throttle to brake and back) AS WELL AS that you are more likely to use the brakes for small adjustments that you might not otherwise make. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMortensen Posted November 10, 2009 Share Posted November 10, 2009 Some of those taps might just be resetting the pads to make sure they haven't knocked back out of the calipers, so that the pedal is firm when you need it, but he is certainly using the brakes mid corner to change the attitude of the car also. One thing I didn't see was him trying to switch from left foot to right foot braking and shifting, which is what I was having so much trouble doing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jt1 Posted November 10, 2009 Share Posted November 10, 2009 I think there's advantages to left foot braking on a road course. When you enter a corner that doesn't require a downshift, you can start rolling on the brake as soon as you start coming off the throttle. Done correctly, this reduces the transition time, since there's no coast, and it lets you manage the weight shift from the rear to the front much more smoothly. This means you can stay on the gas a little longer, and extend the straight. You never completely let off the gas, just enough to let the car push the engine slightly. Then it's real easy to smoothly pick up the throttle midcorner, no transition again, and start accelerating off. Once you get the line figured out, getting around a corner fast is all about the weight transfer and managing the tires. I've compared datalogger graphs from turns I shift to turns I don't shift, and the no shift turns are definitely smoother. At one track, thru a series of turns, I learned to postpone a downshift thru a faster turn, then shift entering a slower turn, and picked up a coupe of tenths. So it works for me, but I've always tried to be a "smooth" type driver. It might not work for some of the curb hopping, sliding type guys. It puts more heat in the brakes, because you're going faster when you begin to brake. I don't make midcorner corrections with the brake, I prefer to do that with the throttle. It takes a while to learn. When I decided to make the transition, it took about a year before I was completely comfortable and could run the car as hard left footing as I did right footing. You quickly learn that your right foot is a lot more educated than your left, and you now have to manage the transition from left to right on shift and no shift corners. If something goes wrong and you get out of rhythm, it gets ugly quick. Lots of flatspotted tires and numerous offs. I do at least one track day a month, and two several months a year, so it took a good bit of seat time to get to what I considered proficient. Maybe I'm just a slow learner. John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zmanco Posted November 10, 2009 Share Posted November 10, 2009 Jon, take a look at 29 seconds - is that what you're referring to? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMortensen Posted November 10, 2009 Share Posted November 10, 2009 Jon, take a look at 29 seconds - is that what you're referring to? Watched it several times, close but not quite by what I'm seeing there. What I was trying to do (after being taught it in a driver's school) was the following: 1. Left foot brake to start braking process 2. Transition to right foot braking- both feet on brake pedal 3. Left foot comes off to work clutch, right foot heel toes to manage downshift It's step number 2 that is damn near impossible. It's hard to press threshold braking hard on the pedal and then squirm your left foot over and right foot onto the pedal in time to make it all work. I was going to try welding an extension on the left side of the brake pedal, but ended up giving up on the whole thing first. If you look at the video, he doesn't transition from left to right foot braking. He jumps from left foot braking to right foot braking and there is a split second where no foot is braking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RS Speed Posted November 11, 2009 Share Posted November 11, 2009 Heel and toe has been in my bag of tricks since I got my drivers license 25 years ago. I had to keep the clunker from stalling while braking, and learned H&T as a result. Same way i've learned to master the heal toe, driving a mafs car with no BOV for a couple years will do that to you. I find myself even doing it on my Z even though it idles fine... bad habit i guess. Funny thing is my toyota truck needs heel toe til this day to keep the rpms high enough when the AC is on so it doesn't cycle the compressor from getting the rpm too low hahah. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaTTSuN Posted November 11, 2009 Share Posted November 11, 2009 I am autoxing this weekend it will prob be raining im going to check this left foot braking out. Of all my car nerdery why didnt i think of this already? haha I think it might help in the wet when a slight correction is more pronounced and smoothness is the key Matt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.