Tony D
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Posts posted by Tony D
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with the light blue caps and the writing on the nut it looks to be swagelock parts.
i believe parkers are black and imperial eastman uses a really dark blue.
For the $$$ amount on the swagelock stuff it's hardly worth the savings---I think the eastman fittings are around $6 each in those sizes...may be as low as $3.
another thing to know, the stainless steel is very nice for under the car. you can get mild steel for use with the mild steel on the car's fuel lines, they will seal. but they will also rust. and that is a little bugaboo I have with the phosphate coated backnuts on some of the swagelock competitors...
you get into fittings overseas, and there are even more knockoffs. curiously they all use the same thread pitch/mating angles/furrel design as swagelock...LOL
historically, parker and imperial both used single compression designs until the swagelock patent ran out. until that time they marketed it as a superior design. when that patent ran out, marketing shifted to the swagelock knockoff line they were selling and touting the 'improvement' of the 'new design'. eventually they got tired of customers like me pointing out the change in the winds, and simply started marketing them as '100% swagelock compatible'... if you can't beat 'em, at least sponge of their name! LOL
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Just make a couple of punch marks where you can get to it and see them...
If it slips you can tell with a mirror and torch, easily and quickly!
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blame cygnus, he dug it up!
It's probably better you didn't go...there was an accident that totalled a 240 as it was leaving the venue--making a left turn a Toyota Tacoma ran the light at 50mph and took the 240 in the rf corner. It was bad. NO braking on the Tacoma at all, and the Z Driver had full on brake (it's still depressed!)
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Compete againt the Belgian Nissan group there at LeMans (Miroux Motorsports) they have an engine they swear is a 2.4.... But I know better! They were turning lap times at Spa comparable to GT350 Shelby Mustangs in FIA trim.
There should be a 240Z at LeMans Classic next year from VA Motorsports out of Holland as well. You will have company!
Welcome, and good to see another Z on the Continent...
Many parts await in an old milking barn outside Utrecht, NL...LOL
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Most Swagelock stuff is locally distributed, and if the seller of the stuff is from one of the authorized distributors listed above, they will need to know where you are using the fittings so they can properly credit the appropriate branch with the sales commission. I live in Riverside, and simply LIE to the Orange Valve and Fitting when I buy locally, since I'm supposed to be credited to the 'SanDiego' location, even though the Orange store is 35 minutes from my house, while SD is more like 1.5 hours...
But I digress. If you are hung on Swagelock, then that's the deal.
Now, if you want knock-off equivalents Imperial-Eastman (Gyro-Loc?) and Parker A-Lock are compatible fittings and are more widely available in general distribution---including from McMaster Carr.
When I worked at APCI some years ago, there was a big purchasing debate, so they bought a box of Swagelock, a box of Parker and a box of Imperial-Eastman fittings...disassembled them mixed the components and then did a 'mixed build' randomly grabbing parts from the box and then testing the fittings as they were made-up.
The results:
Unless you are in medium to high pressure Helium Service, it really doesn't matter what components you use with what. In helium service, they ended up specifying Swagelock only. Curiously, from the Swagelock salesman at the time, it was revealed that the test rig at the Parker R&D Facility was rigged up with Swagelocks (they test with HP Helium!)
But for general purposes, and certianly for our usages, it doesn't 'require' Swagelock, and either of the other two will work satisfactorily.
Now...more personal opinion. I like Swagelock, and buy it for work as well as home. The quality IMO far exceeds what I get from the other two. I don't like the phosphate coated furrells on either, and have found the Imperial-Eastman fittings particularly susceptible to gall without putting a shot of light oil or Dry Film Lube on the fittings before makeup.
For the price of a few fittings, I'd buy the Swagelock. If you are doing a big project and the money gets really exorbitant (like the 3/4" fittings to do an Atlas-Copco ZR6 Condensate Line System...elbows and crap like that, over 45 fittings required at $32+ each...) then the Imperial and Parker will give you the same servicability with slightly less polish and look.
When customers are not concerned that much with pricing, I will go to Swagelock simply because they stock most everything they have in the catalog. But the Imperial stuff out of McMaster can be just as workable.
And regardless of what all of them say, save for high pressure helium, the APCI testing done in the early 90's shows that it doesn't matter who's furrels you put with who's backnuts, and who's fitting bodies---they all make up and hold thousands of pounds of pressure without leaking.
Hope this gives you an alternative. The Parker people have expanded their stores, and they are available in many places that deal with industrial hosing (duh...parker aerospace hoses...LOL) just that many people don't know they exist in that tubing fitting market. And for your fitting, it may be something they will have to order in. Check for a "Parker Store" nearby.
OH, and before I forget, if you are using STOCK lines in the chassis, it is NOT 5/16"! It is a Metric 8mm, and both Swagelock and Imperial Eastman make METRIC FITTINGS that will go right on that baby without any modifications whatsoever. The make a whole line of metric to standard adapters as well if you want to 'switch over' to standard stuff near the engine bay for convineience.
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The regulator won't raise the pressure proprotinally to the boost pressure after 10 PSI manifold pressure. That is if the stock FRP indeed does have a 10 PSI limit, sounds plausible since other OEM FPRs I've seen seem to have about the same limit.
The 10psi limit is imposed by ECU mapping, not because the FPR stops working.
A fuel pressure regulator works as a balanced unit of spring pressure against a seat. If you have a spring pressure set to 37psi, against a seat presure of 37psi, it doesn't open. If you see more pressure on the seat than the spring provides, then the spring pressure is overcome, and the seat cracks open, bleeding pressure (to the return line).
Follow that so far?
Now, you add manifold referencing. Put a hose to a sealed chamber where your spring resides, and connect it to your intake manifold. Now you will have TWO forces working to hold the seat closed. Still only fuel pressure working against the seat, though.
So you're at idle, and have 18" of Hg vacuum in the manifold. Offhand conversions say 1psi=2"Hg of Mercury. So that works out to be roughly -9 psi of pressure, working against your spring pressure of 37psi meaning the effective pressure on the seat is 37-9=28psi. Under high vacuum, you could have 28"Hg in the manifold, or -14psi, and fuel pressure would drop to 37-14=23psi. This is how the old Bosch EFI systems used the injectors they did to run the horsepower. It allows larger injectors to run as 'smaller' injectors under light load, letting you run an increased pulsewidth because the older systems didn't have a lot of resolution...but I digress.
NOW...
Lets go into boost. You throw 10psi at it, and your effective seat pressure is 37+10=37psi. Put 20 psi at it and 37+20=57psi.
It is irrelevant how much boost you throw at the regulator. It simply is a dumb device that uses spring pressure plus referencing pressue to determine ultimate fuel pressure. Stock regulators have been run to 30psi of boost (I used stock FPRs from a BMW to run 25psi+ on a VW I built some loooooong time ago...)
THE LIMITATION IS THE PULSEWIDTH PROGRAMMED INTO THE STOCK ECU!
The same FPR works GREAT at 17psi on my Megasquirt system with 440cc Supra Injectors.
The limitation is not the FPR. It's programming of the ECU for 'standard conditions---which is to say, they programmed the system to run with a failed wastegate running the popoff valve wide open under all rpm conditions. I know, I did that experiment on an 84 Turbo Skyline. Wired the wastegate shut and ran with the pop valve whistling dixie...
The regulator raises on a 1:1 porportional pressure rise. The limit on the stock pump will be around 20psi of boost as the stock internal relief valve lifts and starts bypassing around or just before 60psi (if you are lucky).
The limit on the FPR is the burst pressure on the casing. I have put 100psi to them and haven't blown the casing yet...so to say it stops working above 10psi is incorrect.
Does it provide enough fuel above 10psi? If you have adjustable pulsewidth, yes. If you are using the stock EFI system and ECU...No. That is the ECU's fault, not the FPR's.
Some people will run a solenoid to close the bypass line and run the pump to full pressure when it hits 11 or 12psi...you get a jump from 47 to around 57psi and that is a non-linear fuel delivery which is what the RRFPR's do. Do you 'need' that much fuel at 12psi? Who knows. The only way to know is try. This is a hack-style approach to making it work.
If money is the prime concern, I'd stick to 10psi till I had the money for a Megasquirt, and THEN start upping the boost. Drop your requirement for '12 psi'---I mean what is the magic behind 12psi? You end up spending money for interim patches that you end up throwing away when you up the ante further and go with a proper fueling solution. If you don't have the money to do it right now, when will you have the money to do it over?
Just stick to 10psi until you have the MS and some 370 or 440cc injectors to install as a set, you will be money ahead, trust me!
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270cfm per runner on a ported manifold would outflow JeffP's currnt port which is flowing something like 220cfm at 25" at 0.500" lift.
As I posted above, Jeff knows he looses 30cfm per runner, so knowing 220-30=190CFM for an extrude-honed stock diameter runner.
That help, Bo?
O.T. Threadjack Warning:
Are you going to make the "Hot August Days" Group Z Car Show at Rickie & Ronnie's Drive in (Corner of Sepulveda and Normandie in Torrance) Saturday? 10-2?
Now, back to our regularly scheduled benchracing....
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The original place to vent these lines was via metal tubes and a banjo bolt which put the venting down by where the stock cast iron manifold and headpipe joins.
In the USA they used lines to the air filter for evaporative emissions concerns. They WILL off-gas especially after a lift-throttle at high rpms as with the stock system you are pumping something like 7psi against the floats and have no consumption so it sinks the darned things, and you puke a little fuel up out of the jet---and in extreme cases of a long-rundown you can literally fill the float bowl to overflowing...
Indeed raw gas smell can come from up front. May want to make sure firewall gaskets are intact.
Keeping the stock air cleaner assembly on does have it's advantages! Keeps the smells down quite a bit!
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These parts are availabe new from the Nissan Dealer as well. They are not as expensive as many people think...
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I don't have any photos with me...I don't know what I could show with exteriors...
I know Ianz sent his 240 bumpers to the same place and was really happy with the result. He's as anal as anybody and if he's happy...
He did this around the time of MSA, and has gotten them back. I think his orange car will be at the Hot August Days GroupZ car show at Rickie and Ronnie's Drive In on the corner of Sepulveda and Normandie in Torrance (10 to 2) this Weekend.
Check out www.groupz.com, the newsletter should be up on the site soon for details on time, directions, etc. The car should be there to check out the bumpers in person.
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Gata is somehow related to 'engine' the L-Engine was referred to as 'L-Gata' in Japan.
Hence, Tabo-San-Gata is basically 'The Turbo 3-Liter L Engine' and dey runs forever'....
As for the sleeves being of higher quality...that may be a herring. Metal analysis would be needed. The L-Blocks were of extremely high quality compared to many other vehicles, even today.
Sleeves are constructed in the foundry differently, for better density as well. They may be 'better' than the original early L-Blocks, but then again, they may not...
Sleeves make repairs easier in the future, though, for sure. Especially if you want to keep a set displacement.
The Nissan S20 had sleeves installed from the factory for just that purpose. Replace pistons, sleeves, and rings and remain within your racing displacement class (1998ccs against a 2Liter maximum!)
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WOT on an inertia dyno can be set in about 15-20 minutes. I mean everything. Complete.
The rest of the time is the 'drivability portion' of the map. Places where you are accelerating from a given load cel at less than WOT.
For 'economy' (and others can chime in here) anything below (on a stock cam car) 65KPA and less, and below around 3500rpm...those cels are usually best tuned for 14.7 to 15.5 AFR instead of 12:1.
Sure, it wil lrun well, and fat, and have some more torque.
But your fuel mileage will be atrocious. Anything with 'high vacuum' and 'low rpms' is not where you need WOT AFR's.
If you look at the specifications for the stock ZXT's you realize most of the cars don't go 'open loop' until 3500rpms, or 35% throttle opening.
So basically, where your car spends 95% of it's time is NOT tuned for 'power' but for 'economy' with the leanest AFR you can get by or tolerante without burning valves, or having drivability problems.
My wife's frontier tach juuust under 3500 at 80mph. So you drive 78 and the thing can get 20mpg (and you can see the O2 sensor feedback) speed that up to 81 where it's juuuust over that 3500 Closed-Loop setting in the ECU, and you drop almost instantly to 16mpg.
That kind of difference!
I need to go eat, so I can come back and flesh it out more if you need, but that's the general idea. If you've been dirving your car for a while, you know where that dot floats in most road conditions. Cruising speeds you tune lean best, for economy. WOT and above a given load cel block or rpm where it becomes clear you WANT more power, tune those areas for 'rich best'.
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The ARA conversion originally used a flex-hose on the lower radiator outlet, for the exact same reason you mentioned...
The accumulator dryer is pretty much a universal fittment R12/R134 anyway, it's simply silica gel or activated alumina in there to soak up any residual moisture when comissioning the system. After that is done, it simply acts as a buldge in the line giving a place for liquid to settle and accumulate before offgassing into the compressor. Compressors don't like refrigerant in liquid form being ingested.
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I agree with Bryan...get it in the ball park, and then it's 'control-shift-arrow up or arrow down' to figure out where your peak numbers are.
Most people will run to peak power, then richen slightly to ensure nothing is 'too close to going boom'.
The entire map should be done within 2 hours-3 at the outside.
WOT will be done first, then spend your time doing runs to fill in the load points below.
Generally, a Dynojet tuned car will 'run lean' when you take it out on the road and do a test run. Generally, as stated above, the dyno operators will simply highlight the whole table and bump the fueling up incrementally (less than 5% or so) to give the correct 'true load' numbers you need to run correctly on the street as opposed to on the dyno.
This is if the dyno is inertial only. If they can load brake you and hold the load point, then you can get a more accurate AFR for the engine loaded, and not just accelerating through a point.
And like Bryan says, once the map is optimized, changes for this header, or even a total displacement change only takes a few passes, and well less than an hour.
When we went from 2.8 to 2.0L in the Bonneville Car, the setup took 45 minutes to retune. When we changed header primary length, it was about 15 minutes. Changed the exhaust system configuration to run the belly pan, about 20 minutes...but most of that was B.S. ing with the operator while it was warming up. I think we made three passes and were done!
It's all a matter of playing with it, and changing only ONE parameter at a time. You got time, just go back and do the fueling. Once that's done, play with timing. Then go back and recheck fueling, just to be sure.
There are no set rules for a magic AFR or timing number. Advance it till you see no more power and back off a degree or two. Fueling, go rich, then lean and see where power is hiding. Then move a bit off that for 'margin of error' ... Usually you adjust rich to lean till you see power stop raising, and then go back rich a couple of steps. You can go until you actually see power start dropping before backing off and putting in that margin...but I'd only do that for cruise spots where it's lightly loaded. For WOT, generally rich to lean till power stops raising then back a coule steps rich (rich best)
For cruise, rich to lean till you see power actually fall, then back a couple of steps rich (lean best)
splitting hairs I know, but it returns dividends in fuel economy.
After your base map handles slow roll-ons enable accel enrichmnent and start stabbing the throttle to get the accel and decel fuel cut working correctly.
Sounds like a lot, but if you're methodical, it goes pretty quickly.
If you have a ZX, go to the dyno with the bumper removed for easy fan access to the radiator! LOL
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The regular BHJ damper was originally designed in coordination with Jeff Priddy, who can be found among your ranks.
Do I sense Chris 'treading lightly' to make sure Jeff doesn't have any more stress in his life right now? LOL
I'm sure he will appreciate the mention Chris. The Dampner is probably the only thing that hasn't caused any problems since he's put it on!
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How big is that fitting? Do you expect it to support the PCV role? Where is the anti-reversion valve now?
Which vacuum hoses are you talking about, I addressed the one that was circled in red, as I thought that was the one you wanted information on...
The one with blue tape on it goes the to brake booster
The one in the center of the manifold down below the throttle linkage bar goes to the FPR Vacuum Reference Port.
The AAR valve goes to the J-Pipe off the turbo.
The one hanging there in the foreground used to go to the Carbon Cannister, but like someone just said 'what year car'---really vague request, some details would help. What are you looking for if not what you circled?
Just a thought: showing up at the Z-Club meeting in Buena Park may give you a car you can simply snap photos of to answer these questions, as well as showing up at their car show at Rickie and Ronnies in Torrance (Sepulveda and Normandie) on the 16th (I think)...
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That's considered a 'light wipe' but will total out a car as the bluebook value of a daily drive ZX is under $1000. If costs exceed 50% of the cost, they will total the car.
I have seen worse being driven daily! Likely whatever bounced off the side, took out the factory alloy as well---I'd look to having it put on a 4 Wheel Alignment and seeing if they can get the tires in line. If they can...like said above "It's cosmetic" drive it.
I'd not repair it personally---the reason the car is so cheap is there is no bluebook on it. It won't be worth what you put into the repair. You are better off getting it in a running condition and driving it...and finding one with a better body and doing a driveline swap.
Done that a few times myself...
But don't think you will make a bundle by 'buying cheap'---a running ZX sells all day long for $500 to 700 here in SoCal, they are bought as driveline donors. Body damage simply isn't worth fixing, they have become 'throwaway' as there are plenty of them out there with tired or blown engines and good bodies for a swap.
I'd buy it, simply for the driveline parts. Engine is worth $450, Trans is $250, Differential $150. There's your purchase price. You can get $200 for the scrap value on the body if you shop around and have a trailer to tow it to the scrapyard. So from that perspective alone, it's a good buy. But I'd not get illusions about making money off it by pouring money into it and 'resurrecting' it...that would be folly.
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I parked the car to visit a friend of mine for a few minutes, came back out to the car and it was VERY hard to start...Felt the fuel rail and it was warm enough that you didn't want to hold on to it.
Exactly the conditions it was made to combat! There is a period from around 5 minutes after you do a hot-shutdown (in warm weather, above say 85 and running on the highway) to about 12 minutes where no matter what they tried, Nissan could not prevent the formation of vapor in the rail due to pressure rise, and FPR venting it back to the tank. Initially it starts with the fuel expanding and venting, then pressure drops and it flashes... The S30's with EFI does this, and it's the reason the S130's have a priming pulse, as well as the cooler on them. In JDM, they had a vehicles with plastic valve covers to combat heat transmission in un-vented hood engine compartments like the Cedric, Leopard, Gloria, Laurel, etc...
Timer criteria is coolant temp above something like 215F, and as mentioned no longer than about 15 minutes of runtime after shutdown.
It may turn on some time after shutdown as well, should the temperature rise to the point it gets triggered, but in any case it will not start after being 'ignition off' for 15 minutes no matter what happens.
One thing you can do to forestall the hard-starting is simply change the 'priming pulse' for your Fuel Pump---make it run for 10-15 seconds to take that heat out of the rail and get fluid petrol up there, it may be stumbly after the start, but it is FAR better than trying to crnak and bleed that vapor out of the rail using the normal pulse and cranking/cranking/cranking.
I've noticed it's exacerbated of course in hotter weather, but also as your tank level goes down. Ever do a fuel temperature reading when you go highway driving with less than a 1/4 tank of gas? Scary how hot it will get!
Yeah, I know, I got WAAAY too much time on my hands to be checking crap like that out of simple idle curiosity. What can I say? I'm diseased!
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Frame Rails, running the Z432-Style JDM exhaust with twin 50mm pipes, they tuck up nicely, and flow like a 2.7" exhaust. I'm currently replicating the system in 2.5" Twins because that looks like as far as I can go and still get the same frame-rail-is-the-lowest-point kind of setup, and that should flow significantly better for the new turbo...
On the stock 260Z, when loaded, the frame rails will hit on the speedee-oil-change place floor opening surroiund. I get out, and six guys lift the car by the fender lips to get it over the pit all the way without the terrible scraping sound disturbing all the other customers... Maybe the springs are sagged a bit... Maybe I'm fat. Maybe it's a combination of both.
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How come guys making $10.95 an hour are considering buying top-end sequential injection units...
I make, er... "more" than that, and am still scouring e-bay for used parts to keep my unpainted slog-beasts goin'?????
I KNOW:
No wife, no kids?
LOL
Maybe I'm just cheap.
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Plug the original PCV hole, and retap it --- the PCV pipe and hose shows you where pretty clearly. The N42 manifold has the PCV right where the turbo scroll goes, the Turbo Manifolds have it relocated to the place where your hose is showing it to be. Simply move it.
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Fortunately, the weaving in and out of traffic saved me. The chopper couldn't get a good "pace" on us, so he couldn't say that we were specifically going XXX speed.
When I was taking a 71 240Z out to Phoenix on I-10 some years ago (when the CHP was not supposed to be using radar) I got in behind a VW GTI (what is it with VW's?) and was crnaking along at XXX, I was drafting him, and pulling out to cool down. We would swap places occasionally to 'share the risk'... sad thing was on the last section I was in the lead, I opened it up and realized the reason he was going XXX was that was as fast as he could go---advantage Carburettors and no electronic limiter.
Anyway, he took his exit, and the guy who was on the trip with me eventually caught up and we kept cooking to the border. Suddenly I see him flashing his headlights in the Stanza Wagon (he had a Fuzzbuster in there), so I HAUL on the e-brake as I see the CHP Cessna up behind me.
My partner is flash-flash-flashing away in a frenzied manner and I've slowed back down to 65 (10 over)... Then down to 60 where I maintain and he catches up to where I can see him pointing to the fuzzbuster and giving me the 'what gives?' with his shoulders/hands. This is the middle of the desert. There's nothing out here.
As we take the 'Blythe Wake-Up Curve' I see a CHP Mustang GT Interceptor coming the other way. The driver literally stuck his head out the window and 'evil eyed me' as I passed! Across the median---it was a grossly exaggerated 'I'm watching you!' kinda message.
We stop for gas, and my partner tells me out of the blue his Fuzzbuster went off. Once. When he flashed his lights at me (our prearranged signal) and I hauled it down so drastically (without brake lights) the Fuzzbuster started going nuts again.
Apparently the CHP was using radar in the planes, and once they hit you with the radar, they would 'legally pace you'...I have no doubt they made the pacing match the radar readout, too.
But that CHP in the Mustang literally poking his head out the window to glare at me just made me laugh! Ever since then, I watch the skies! LOL
Just once, having access to SAM technology....
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Like you said the 11 lbs ones didnt work better than the 15 lbs one.
That is not what I said. What I said was my Japanese lightened flywheel felt more like my old Tilton 11# aluminum one, and was considerably more 'snappy' than the 13# units currently being marketed.
The Tilton 11# unit was a very nice unit, and IMO the 13# unit that is out there today is kind of disapointing the way it reacts.
Yes, where the weight is removed is very important, but simple physics says the more you can take off the better.
The Japanese units concentrate on maximizing the weight reduction at the furthest portions of the flywheel, and as it was explained to me, once you get within about a 125mm diameter from crank centerline you won't accomplish anything of significance anyway. Curiously the Japanese Machinist pointed out that this number depends on which crank pulley you have installed, and if you have a larger diameter pulley, you can leave more on in the center of the flywheel. Their opinion was that metal left there contributed to strength, and as such paid a double dividend. Though they did completely machine the back of the flywheel to remove rough casting. They looked very nice indeed. And behind the frictional face the tended to leave a little more material.
The bad thing about a 240mm flywheel is that you need the facing thickness at 240mm diameter meaning any 240mm flywheel will rev slower than the comparable 225mm flywheel as the intertial effect of that ring will be more at 240 diameter than it will at 225... But it's splitting hairs. You cut your flywheel down to 15#, and you still have a 24# pressure plate! Get someone to disassemble and cut THAT down comparably and you will REALLY see some more snappy acceleration!
For some reason the flywheels I have had lightened in the USA don't seem as snappy as the one I have in the car form Japan. I still have to pull it down to compare the cuts. It makes me curious as to the difference in cut-down they did. I notice differences, but haven't had that Japanese Flywheel off the car since 1989, and the last time I had to put a clutch in it was late 1989 or early 1990... (first NISMO Clutch assy smoked...yeah, 250HP 250ft-lbs capability my butt!)
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Now, do it all in Nigeria with AK's cracking around you from the local militia...and you basically have my weekend...
3.1 Stroker Compression ????
in Nissan L6 Forum
Posted
valve clearance is something dependent on camshaft selection and actual assembly and testing on the engine. 'clay your pistons for valve clearance check' is the term used in the old days. that will only be answered by assembling your engine and checking it.
if clearance is inadequate, have the piston heads flycut for clearance. that's what the trial assembly is designed to sort out.