BLKMGK

I'm not sure which is scarier - the open deck like a Honda waiting to flex or the mile long chains waiting to whip around. I guess if you weren't bumping the redline way up the chaqins might be okay but once power was up there I'd worry a bit about the bores moving around. I'd agree that the #3200 weight is a bit much. I'm not sure why it's that high and perhaps it is the Supras. I'd agree that's too much - how is an old RX3 or 510 supposed to weigh that much?! What's the new 350Z weigh?

I hardly think that because we've not seen a hi-po VQ that it's not possible. The motor hasn't been out long in a performance application. It's not like we have any evidence that it'll blow - lack of power on the few project cars out there isn't evidence. Pictures of split blocks on the other hand would be If you've got some PROOF or a source then by all means share it. I don't know that the VQ is a big candidate since it's a new motor and expensive with somewhat unknown potential but.... Afew 2JZ dynos can be found here -> http://www.geocities.com/j_nenni/ although the single 20PSI run is on a turbo that's big enough that 20PSI probably isn't enough. I'll have a 20PSI T-78 graph later I hope, it was on pump gas, up over 615RWHP, and used a set of those peaky cams. That car hasn't raced yet, Justinn's has more than a few times Note that these are 3liter motors, not 3.5 strokers, and are daily driven street type cars. Also - do ALL of the racing classes make you stick to the SAME manufacturer's drivetrain?

Looks like a Supra dyno heh. I'll see what I can find in the way of 20PSI JZ curves when I've got a chance. Isn't the Pathfinder also using some derivative of that VQ block? These blocks may be easier to come by than it might seem at first if this is the case. Our O2 Pathfinder might have one of them but I'm not sure (is what I was told anyway).

www.jagsthatrun.com buy the Z swapping book from JTR and read it cover to cover - that's step #1.

How much faster? I'm not really sure to tell you the truth, but enough to make Toyota change from a single turbo on the older model Supra to a twin design on the 93+ model. Same with the Nissan Z, same with the RX-7. They all went from a single turbo system to a twin-turbo system. But I don't want to get into a pissing match about Z's vs. Supra's vs RX-7's. I like them all. We all need to understand that they were the last of their breed, the pinnacle of technology in Japanese muscle cars. Their successors are all going to be different, more practical and more cost effective. Those were SEQUENTIAL systems in both the Supra and RX7, the Nissan did it for packaging reasons IMO. I have ownedown both FD3 RX7 and MKIV Supra. Set either up as a "true" twin system rather than sequential and both cars become slow spooling pigs. Some of the folks with twin systems, including owners of both Supra and RX7, switch to singles for more performance - I did. I believe even some DSM guys are doing this too. Nissan guys wind up swapping turbos rather quickly too don't they? In fact they might have been the ones I heard of that were going single with a V motor rather than the DSM guys (both maybe?)- some very nice headers for that swap if I recall. I don't believe that those cars were the absolute pinnacle either if what I've read about the new Skyline coming is true - we'll see. There's also something to be said for the RX8, EVO, STI, and I'll give the 350Z some credit. I've read some things to suggest that the 350Z motor is full of good stuff however the owner putting that forth may have been full of other things too That it will require an aftermarket turbo strikes it from my personal desired list and I wish Mazda had stepped up too. Do ALL of the classes being considered require same manufacturer drivetrains? Or is that just certain pro classes? Are there any regional classes that might be more liberal or will this show go on the road so to speak? I think picking a specific class and scoping out the current competition would be the VERY first thing to do. I've watched a few guys build "race cars" only to discover that they fit in NO class that they could be competitive in. That's a bad trap to fall into and expensive too

Umm, how much faster do you think those TWO turbos are going to spool up? A hundred RPM or two? I'd be willing to bet it's nearly that close and certainly no more than 500RPM. If you think that will make or break a race think again. I can launch on boost if I want (okay, anti-lag and 2step but still) and once spooled I'm not out of boost for the race. For that matter I can slip the clutch and be in the sweet spot right off the bat with some practice. The REALLY fast Supras run automatics that REALLY eliminate many of the issues I've got launching my 6speed. Supra guys are now slipping domestic trannys into their street cars and single digit street driven cars are the result - it's sick! Again, post some dynos with full docs on the motors and we can do some comparisons. There ARE twin turbo kits for the Supra too and they make HUGE power - and lag like mad too. Most Supra owners who run them admit that looks was one of their big considerations in purchasing them. I do know of at least one that has custom turbos that should spool more quickly but I'm not convinced it'll be faster than a well done single. I guess I'm just not seeing the 2JZ as being such a poor choice, driving one everyday that has the capability to make over 600 at the wheels on pump gas might be skewing my view though I hope to dyno it soon, hopefully it won't embarass me! Bob makes some good points. There's some excitement over the new VQ motors for sure. All sorts of rumors about big power from them when turbo'ed too but nothing solid. Doing the development on that, which probably means blowing a few up, sounds pricey to me. Keeping to the local events isn't a bad idea IMO. Answering calls from all over isn't much fun and that IS a very good point for sure. My friend's shop answers quite a bit of silly phone calls and they don't even have a listed number! It does impact their work. If you're going to go tube frame you're certainly not resatricted to the 240Z, cool as that might be, either....

Well, if what I'm reading is correct Ara is in the SIXes with a 2JZ -> http://www.nhrasportcompact.com/2002/drivers/A_Arslanian.html and -> http://urbanracer.com/features/idrc_sumslam02_article.html How fast did that Z run again? BTW he's got TWO cars identically prepared running that fast so it's not a fluke. His stock unibodied Supra runs 9s with a six speed. There are Supras running in the 9s with functioning A/C that can be street driven. Twin turbos don't necessarily buy you a broader power band unless they're sequential BTW. Each turbo receives HALF the exhaust flow so they must be much smaller as a result. The advantage 2 turbos might have in that case is less mass for a slightly quicker spool. Many Supra don't bother to change cams until they make 700RWHP or more where they can begin to become a restriction (I'm told). A set of 264cams is still streetable with a good idle and it's not until you goto 272 cams that you have to start idling the car a bit higher. I MIGHT goto 264cams but will more likely have a head ported and beefed first. Extending my RPM range to 8K is feasible on stock internals and the racing 2JZ run insane RPM. If 1K FWHP is what you want a 2JZ can actually do that on stock internals for awhile. Certainly you could call a 2JZ "peaky" and the turbos laggy but after driving one of those "huge laggy turbos" for awhile I've found it's not so bad, I make power by 4K. Mine won't take me to 1KHP but it will hit mid 600RWHP on pump gas tuned correctly and I know of some making 800RWHP on race gas with mild cams (street driven). This would be a T-78. The bigger sized T-88 can still be street driven and pulls down huge numbers (900+ RWHP). In fact I'm pretty sure that Scotty has seen Jesus' car before and he runs a big T-88 on it. You can't compare a single street race video and typify an engine's power. Especially since the Supra now has a much better tuning option with the AEM ECUs. We're picking up TONS of power with this box. Tell ya' what, how about posting some of these non-peaky high powered VG dynos. 2JZ dyno graphs all but fall out of trees but I don't think I've seen too many high powered VG dyno graphs floating around. I'm sure I can find a few to compare, big power 2JZ are pretty common . Since this car must apparently stay Nissan powered it'll help out Jamie too. Jamie I agree that building a V8 car isn't the way to go, there weren't enough of them competing and everyone whined about them. Run a street tire class and you will appeal to the fans more and perhaps not spend quite so much on parts I think a 240Z is a good choice and would lean towards the RB motors too except that replacement parts might not be so easy to find

Since when is fraud a civil matter? Have I missed something here?!

The AEM EMS allows me to control a wastegate solenoid - in this case from a GM Typhoon - using a modulated pulsewidth. I can choose max boost, I can choose between different boost levelsfuel maps, and I can set target boost versus vehicle speed. In other words I can run reduced boost at lower MPH and allow it to ramp up as speed increases. Only trouble with this last is that my car loses traction even at it's very lowest boost setting

My understanding is that the Bosch sensor isn't as accurate or as fast. The NTK sensor lasts FAR longer than 500 hours. If you consider these are used in OEM Honda apps that must have a Federal Emissions warranty you'll understand why 500 hours is a joke. That number is quoted from Horiba or some such company that repackages NTK sensors and sells them for hundreds more. Yes, that's right - the $5K A/F meter you speak of is most likely using the SAME NTK sensor with a different connector. If memory serves that company removes the calibration resistor and puts a different connector on the sensor - and then sells it for like $600. That company has an "exclusive" license in the US with NTK to sell A/F meters using that sensor - this is probably why NTK may be getting excited. To be clear - that "high dollar" sensor is a $120 NTK off of an OEM Honda application. The chances of them doing any special calibrations on every sensor that goes out the door is funny. The Techedge "free air" calibration is likely as good. I can assure you too - blipping the throttle using the NTK sensor and something like an FJO controller does indeed show you more than a few samples a second - especially if you use something to read the A/F other than their supplied display. The reason for this is because FJO, and probably Techedge, take multiple samples, averagebuffer them, and then output to the display. I can actually see this on my ECU's display. The data would flip by too quickly on the LED display and be a blur otherwise - as it is it's still difficult to read. It's accurate enough that my vehicle can do per cylinder closed loop if I calibrate the ECU so that it knows what cylinder is firing when. If you want faster though NTK sells a control box but no display - it's supposed to react even faster than the FJO but again uses the SAME NTK sensor. I've been told not to exceed 800 degrees with the NTK sensor as well but post turbo I seldom see temps that high anyway. Placing it pre-turbo means I've got to worry about pressure compensation which few boxes do. Honda will be using a slightly different version of that NTK sensor in some upcoming new vehicles, it'll be interesting to see if there's an aftermarket for that sensor. If so then Techedge and others need only reprogram the PICs in their boxes for the new response curve and carry on. Will be interesting to see this new companies products. If you get a chance ask them if they will be pressure compensating their A/F readings. Right now I only know of one company in the budget range doing that but I believe he's using the NTK sensor and isn't charging as much as $500 if memory serves. Unfortunatly his boxes aren't yet available but when they are he'll be offering a version that runs two sensors for V engines which will work great on the SBC in my Z with an ECU that can handle two W/B O2. Anyway, I'm not sweating this yet. There's a shortage right now and they're hard to find. I'm not yet convinced that they're pulling the sensors from the market. In fact I'm not sure it's legal for a company to not allow replacement parts to be sold other than the dealer. I'm fuzzy here but I seem to recall there are some rules here that dealers must follow. Can you imagine the angry Honda owners when suddenly they're told it's $600 for a new O2 sensor? You think airbags and HID get stolen now? Just imagine what will occur if this were to come to pass BTW - your source is about to produce a box that's Bosch sensed. Other than this source have you any others that can confirm this? I'd think there would be a huge number of people screaming about this all over if it were this bad. I guess if NTK wants to give up the market that's their issue...

I hate to say it but the 5speed might have to be used.It's not as strong. Still worth measuring I think and MAYBE even moving the motor forward. Hearesy I know but the 6speed is SWEEAT and just about as bulletproof as the motor If no one can find measurements on the length of the 6speed I can try measuring mine next time it's up on a lift....

Yes, NTK and NGK are related - I actually knew that but whatever. Echland is probably the company he's talking about. As I understand it MOTEC or HORIBA has some sort of exclusive rights to using these sensors for A/F measuring and everyone else is supposed to use them for engine operation. You have to sign papers to that effect to get an NTK heater controller apparently. I'm goingto try and confirm this - this sounds MUCH more plausible - and scary too. We shall see, perhaps it's just a temporary shortage....

BTW - there's a 35K mile 1998 2JZGTE motor on Supraforums right now for $3500 complete but sans trans and wiring harness. IMO that harness is important. A JDM frontcut might not be a bad idea to get everything...

I would point out - there's only been one manufacturer of this part all along. It was reboxed by other manufacturers like Bosch as their own - close examination of them proves the original source. Honda has some exclusive rights on that sensor from what I gather and is continuing to use it. I don't think it's going to up and go away. The laws of supply and demand do still apply though and having a spare wouldn't be a bad idea. I may pick one up just in case but I'm not going to panic. BTW - wouldn't a sale of this technology be recorded somewhere? What company purchased this if it occured? Perhaps we can research it that way and get to the heart of the matter

The lift will fit under 12fot ceilings? I did some measuring and took a look at the specs for Eagle lifts and it looked like 13feet was going to be needed Plan to refinance as well to do this in my garage. Vroom! Almost wish I could start from scratch

Believe that's an FD3

Found this on a Miata site. I'm pondering a turbo Miata as a next playtoy and thought that this info might help out anyone trying to put the Tf into the Z with a Ford motor since the Miata guys do the same thing... http://www.miataforum.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=34;t=000483#000000 If I understand correctly that will be info for a bracket that can be used to mount aq slave cylinder to the T5 - no mo' cable issues. Duh, a more direct link would be smarter! http://www.autoworks.cc

If you're looking at the )3 Cobra I PROMISE you that it's the one with the most "grunt". With VERY little work you can be pushing over 400RWHP with tons of torque. That is one nasty critter and of those choices it would be mine. The M3 is a more refined car though if comfort is your desire.

Bah, he's got 99% of th hard stuff done guys. He was probably fitting the DP and decided to swing it upwards for grins and snap a pic of it - don't be so harsh. If I were that close to owning a completed turbo Z I'd be doing handstands!

This from th eHonda engineer I've been speaking with "The only company in question about this sensor is NGK, and no they are not going out of business as far as I know. They have been around since the dawn of day and their stuff comes as OE fitment on something like 80% of the auto industry." He also commented that TWO new Honda apps would be coming out using OEM UEGO sensors including at least one that would be using TWO of them in each vehicle. This sensor is suposed to be slightly different but stated that minor mods to any of the existing setups out there would accomodate it. From this I gather that the response curve changed some so burning an EPROM or PIC ought to fix that. Supplies of these snesors have been low for awhile as there's been heavy demand by folks like us using them to measure A/F. This is why they're hard to find - production hasn't stopped and the SINGLE source isn't going out of business anytime soon. The Bosch 13246 O2 is the NTK sensor BTW. http://www.techedge.com.au/vehicle/wbo2/wbntk.htm

NO and apparently getting a 1JZ bellhousing is near impossible in this country. I spoke to one guy who's been waiting a year! Can any of our OZ guys help out? If I could get about 3 1JZ bellhousings over here for 5speeds I could make some folks VERY happy!

In my case I just zipped off the stock mounts with an air chisel, installed the T56, and then used a prybar to press the passenger side of the tunnel out some. I only had to make room for the reverse switch - it fit with no real banging that I remember.

SWEEET!!

Newer injector design? Not by much! LOL! Side feed injectors - find 'em in other apps. People are converting to top feed Bosch style in the Supra world. It's a reliable motor but if you're going to the trouble do a single turbo. Oh, and the N/A have a 5speed attached to them. The 6speed has it's handle WAY back apparently so it supposedly won't fit.

Huh?! umm, NO! They're NTK sensors that Bosch and others shove into their boxes. I'm pretty sure that no one has bought Bosch out The Bosch sensors that some kits ALLOW the use of (the upcoming Techedge 2.0) are supposed to be slower, more expensive, and are supposed to have a shorter life. I'm not panicking until I see some proof guys. I know someone who works with NTK engineers and is a Honda employee - I'll ask him about this. If anyone would know he would - IMO this is FUD.