JMortensen

Never put a prop valve in the front! I suspect that the options are: a. bigger rear brakes or b. dual masters.

Just got a call from my supplier, they're expecting to ship my parts mid next week, so I won't get them until late next week or beginning of the following week.

I don't know why Neverdone posted the picture of the Factory Five suspension. Probably because it looks cool as hell. I was taking issue with the assertion that the SLA would be heavier. If someone did put this suspension on their Z or ZX, t wouldn't be the first time a suspension swap was done. Seems odd to me that people seem to want to swap out the rear and leave the front alone. Maybe they have some bit of insight that we don't have. Semi-trailing arm can be made to work just fine, and I was racing against semi-trailing arm cars that I could never quite catch. But if I were designing a race car from scratch, I wouldn't pick it as a starting point.

You'd have to really measure to check it out, but I think even that Factory Five entire subframe with suspension might be close in weight or lighter than the stock semi-trailing arm. The Ford diff is 29 lbs lighter than the longnose R200. No more rear crossmember. I'm sure those tubular control arms are lighter than the Nissan stamped semi-trailing arms. The shocks are much smaller and lighter than what a 280ZX has. I wouldn't be surprised if the net weight was lighter, but you've got SLA instead of semi-trailing arms. What might be a pain is connecting that subframe into the chassis. I would expect that this would be best for a race car where you could tie it into a roll cage instead of trying to attach to the unibody. By the way that subframe with suspension is $2200, but you also need the parts from an IRS 8.8 donor vehicle, and then whatever upgrades you want there. I would expect to pay about $4500 or $5000 if I were going to buy that and make it the way I wanted and install it in my car. YMMV. If you just did the F8.8 diff, then it's GOING to be lighter than the shortnose, unless you make the mounts out of lead.

I need to read that book again. I got a bit turned off by the style of the book and I think I didn't comprehend or retain a lot of his messages because of the way it is written. Everything is rules of thumb, little or no principles to explain them. I checked and did find two very useful tidbits on toe, one that a rear toe in setting helps to get drive out of the inside tire on corner exit, and the other that the heavier you go with the front toe out and the rear toe in, the better set up the car will be for tight corners. I also totally didn't understand and completely glossed over his instructions on setting brake bias until he commented on it elsewhere in more detail. I reposted that info here previously and I think that was a really great bit of insight. Here it is again: http://forums.hybridz.org/index.php/topic/99500-tail-wagging-under-hard-braking/page__view__findpost__p__932930

FWIW Richard, I always ran more than 1/16" rear toe in and I felt that it made the car easier to handle on hard braking and easier to catch if the rear end got loose.

Hey Dan, is that a petcock hanging down about 1.5" off the ground in the 1st and last shots? Car looks friggin amazing. I think I'd be worried about knocking that thing off though...

If I might make a suggestion: Do a Ford 8.8 IRS diff from an Explorer. You're going to have to do custom CV shafts anyway, and you can get diff ratios from 2.73 to 6.17 (most gears are under $300) and there are loads of lockers and limited slips available (most limited slips are under $500). I would guess that they are stronger than the R200, but they weigh a little less than the R180.

I believe www.betamotorsports.com sells them and they're discussed at some length in the big strut thread. Should be in the FAQ.

Looking for the STi R180 inner CV joint that plugs into the diff. Don't need the rest of the CV shaft, just the inner joint and it will be much easier to ship separately. To remove, just cut the boot and hammer the CV joint off of the end of the shaft. Please PM me if you have one. Thanks.

I'd need a set of inner CV's, and an order for the complete kit to do it, but yeah, it could be done.

I think Ken is measuring ride height to the frame rail, not the rocker, so that might make a difference in terms of ride height. I agree with John's other recommendations. I might be inclined to go a little more on the toe out, especially for autox, and I'd be inclined to keep the tire pressures low to get some heat in them. I'd also suggest a pyrometer to eliminate some of the guessing if you don't already have one.

I'll be making all the noise I can when I get the prototype parts in, have no fear.

The Datsun suspension doesn't have any pro or anti squat, and neither does the SLA that replaced it since the control arms are still parallel to the ground, unless I'm missing something. So if the squat geometry is the same, then the lack of squat is probably due to the spring rate or compression damping on the shocks, which are two things you could change on the original strut setup without any trouble.

SLA has (potentially) better camber control. It also has less stiction as the suspension moves in a turn, because the shock itself isn't side loaded like our struts are. By making his own pushrod linkage, Mongo has effectively made the rate adjustable, so he can make the spring and damper stiffer or looser by changing the size of the lever acting on it, and he can make the system digressive or progressive in function as well. How much better is it? Well, if you get the geometry wrong it could easily perform worse. This certainly looks a lot heavier than the stock suspension too, so weight is another important factor. I'd be curious to know if the car was faster with struts or with this SLA pushrod setup and whether the difference was really noticeable from the driver's seat, or whether it could be discerned at all.

They're held in with a snapring, so a prybar or a big screwdriver pops them out. Really though, if you're going to a 300ZX diff, you should take the whole 280Z diff and mustache bar because you need the pinion flange to bolt up the driveshaft and the mustache bar too. Get the CLSD if you can. I'll have chromoly CV's and stub axles in about a week that you can just bolt in and they will be plenty strong for your RB swap.

I think the way you worded it initially you're basically saying you want to make the upright the spring. That doesn't work. You could put a spring in from the lower control arm (or base of the upright) to the frame like a Miata, I'm guessing that's what you meant, but your upright cannot be your spring in a LCA arrangement, because it would have to go to full bump on one control arm or the other before the spring would do anything at all.

Agree with Randy about the ability to break any tool, but disagree about some of the other stuff. I've had more trouble warrantying Snap-On tools than anything else. Sears guy has never said "What were you doing with this screwdriver when it broke" to me. I know my Snap-On dealer was a bit of a tightwad though.

I should have some axles out in a week or so that will handle anything you throw at them and will have a lifetime guarantee against breakage. I'm impatiently waiting for the prototype set to arrive.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/2010-Camaro-SS-/170650112633?pt=US_Cars_Trucks&hash=item27bb8a1279&clk_rvr_id=238745107020&toolid=10001&mpre=http%3A%2F%2Fcgi.ebay.com%2Febaymotors%2F2010-Camaro-SS-%2F170650112633%3Fpt%3DUS_Cars_Trucks#ht_4380wt_1006&clk_rvr_id=239260952045&clk_rvr_id=245083398837&clk_rvr_id=245144796369&clk_rvr_id=246284554321

I think you want to move the diff down to lower the CG. You can get the driveshaft angles worked out with the diff at the stock height.

Simple answer: I don't know. The reduced ride height of a 240Z should give more clearance, see this thread: http://forums.hybridz.org/index.php/topic/100094-cv-axle-discussion/page__st__20 As to why they work in the 280 but bind in the 240, I don't really know. We're using the 280 mustache bar, so unless the bolts through the frame are in a different spot, the diff should be in the same spot from left to right. I haven't measured a 280Z control arm for length, nor have I measured the thickness of the companion flange vs the 240, maybe there is a difference there. Internet legend says that the 280 halfshafts are shorter, John Coffey and I and many others have checked that one and found it not to be true. There are several problems with swapping the 280 suspension in: the insulators are taller (easy enough to swap those out), the strut inserts are taller (could be sectioned, but not as easy a job), the springs are different lengths and the spring perches are different heights (not so bad if you're sectioning and running coilovers), the control arms and strut tubes are heavier, and the brakes are different (change prop valve???). I don't really know the differences above and beyond that, but I think that shortening the halfshaft is not that big a job, and probably easier to do than all the extra stuff necessary to swap 280 rear suspension into a 240.

I talked to Ken (wheelman) on the phone last night and I think we got this pretty well figured out. I had calculated 1/16" of clearance, Ken said on his car he had between 1/8" and 1/4" clearance using the driver's side halfshaft on the passenger's side of the car. Where that discrepancy comes from is anyone's guess, but my car has so many variables (camber plates, poor man's toe adjuster, control arms, etc), his has camber plates too, and there may be some variation from chassis to chassis, and it's pretty tough to get a real accurate measurement in there because you have to bend the tape measure and it's in a weird spot, etc. If you use the 1/16" estimate from my calculations and take the middle of his estimate at 3/16", we're only 1/8" off of each other, so that's not too big a difference all things considered. The question again is does his setup work without binding at all, and if he has 3/16" of clearance, I think the answer is probably yes. There might be some other factors which exacerbate the situation, like if you have aftermarket control arms that are shorter than stock or if your camber plates allow more neg camber than the ones on my car, etc. Also I think bushing compliance might be an issue, if you have stock rubber bushings they might give enough so that the CV's end up putting "some" pressure on the side of the diff. We both agreed that switching to my new shaft lengths poses no problems and would put the CV joint closer to the middle of the housing as well. We also talked about people who have had limited slip differential damage due to the CV's bottoming, and he was originally under the impression that this pressure from the CV was compressing the clutch stack and that was somehow causing damage. I think the opposite is true, because when the clutch stack compresses it moves the side gear towards the wheel, and this pressure moves the side gear that the CV attaches to towards the center of the diff. Without having seen the innards of one of the diffs that suffered damage, I think there are a couple likely scenarios. First is that the CV puts a load on the side gears and that actually pushes really hard on the spider gears in the middle and then they are forced to turn on each other, so they give up. Second would be that the carrier bearings give up because the carrier is being pushed one way or the other (especially in a turn) instead of floating in the middle and the suspension taking side loads. Third is the carrier moves laterally due to side load changing backlash, so this may be what happens after your carrier bearings give up in the 2nd scenario, and this causes a problem with the ring and pinion engagement, and that causes damage. So those are my theories, I guess I'll have to see how accurate they are when someone produces photos of a damaged diff. I'm going to sell the driver's side CV only and also sell the two CV's as a set, you guys can figure out if you want to move the stock driver's side to the passenger's side or just buy the set. Now I just have to wait for them to come so I can check fitment. I hate waiting.

There are two "stub axles" in the back of the car. There is the part that the wheel bolts to, which is a stub axle. It has a shaft that sticks through the strut housing, and there is a companion flange on the other side, this all bolts together and holds the rear wheel bearings in. There is another stub which fits into the side of the differential. Between the diff stub and the companion flange you put the halfshaft or CV shaft. If you want to simplify things, I would get all the parts you need first. That means the mustache bar and parts from a 280Z R200 and either a CV kit that fits correctly or a shortened driver's side halfshaft. Consider your outer stub axle options (leave it alone vs upgrade to chromoly) and then make a decision about whether you feel you need to upgrade. You do not need the R200 to drive the car, but the CLSD makes a HUGE difference in how the car feels and is well worth the effort in the end.

Not following you entirely. I was using 2.125" because I have Ross's billet companion flanges, which give an extra 3/8" of clearance. I shortened the CV to make room for the thicker welded flange.