rturbo 930 Posted May 31, 2017 Share Posted May 31, 2017 If i could spend around 2k to get there it would be ok.... I can do the cam myself but i would send the head for the headwork.... I do most of the work myself on my cars execpt some internal engine works that i rather not mess with..... I just dont want to get to a point that i would regret to not have swapped another engine instead..... That's not a big budget. Actually, for that budget, triple carbs and headers would probably take up half of it. One other thing is that you are also somewhat limited by your head, which should be an N47, which has exhaust port liners in it. You can remove them, but from what I've read, the resulting port shape/flow is not ideal, and it's actually not a good idea. You can still have some work done on it though, and see improvement. If you can buy another head with work done already that might save you some money. For that budget, with a focus on power, I would do megasquirt, some head work, a cam, exhaust (minus headers), and a really good tune, and see what that gets you. Beyond that, try to strip some weight off the car. You're at somewhat of a disadvantage there since you have a late 280Z which is heavier and harder to strip weight from. Removing bumpers and AC (if it has it) would be a good start, and a lightweight, free flowing exhaust too. Get rid of all the excess emissions stuff in the engine bay that you won't be using. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mforget Posted May 31, 2017 Author Share Posted May 31, 2017 That's not a big budget. Actually, for that budget, triple carbs and headers would probably take up half of it. One other thing is that you are also somewhat limited by your head, which should be an N47, which has exhaust port liners in it. You can remove them, but from what I've read, the resulting port shape/flow is not ideal, and it's actually not a good idea. You can still have some work done on it though, and see improvement. If you can buy another head with work done already that might save you some money. For that budget, with a focus on power, I would do megasquirt, some head work, a cam, exhaust (minus headers), and a really good tune, and see what that gets you. Beyond that, try to strip some weight off the car. You're at somewhat of a disadvantage there since you have a late 280Z which is heavier and harder to strip weight from. Removing bumpers and AC (if it has it) would be a good start, and a lightweight, free flowing exhaust too. Get rid of all the excess emissions stuff in the engine bay that you won't be using. With the 2k budget i was ruling out the webers for sure. Your description is pretty much what i have in mind now after all those discussions, bumpers and ac are already off, emission stuff will come off, so MS, headwork, cam and exhaust, possibly headers.... I could start from there and see how it goes..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turbogrill Posted June 1, 2017 Share Posted June 1, 2017 The best NA bang for the buck seems to be: - N47 on flattop pistons - Megasquirt fuel only - Hot cam - If over 200hp then Supra non turbo injectors - Headers / Exhaust recommended but not critical - Head work recommended but expensive The above list is for not optimal from a power perspective but from a labour/cost perspective. Some comments: - It's better to do a shimmed P79 but it will probably be more expensive for you - If you want to make it simple pick a cam with moderate lift (<=0.460"). This doesn't require any new valve springs. - Stock injectors cant handle more than ~200hp, getting supra non trubo injectors seems cheaper then zxt injectors - For moderate RPMs you can live with stock ignition. Have megasquirt control timing adds some complexity. - Head work is very expensive but will get you more HP for big cams. However it's not critical, 290 duration cam with stock head will give more power than stock cam. - If you can afford headers and a decent exhaust then great! Also do some suspension work! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mforget Posted June 1, 2017 Author Share Posted June 1, 2017 Hey great infos again thanks! Ill probably send my current N47 head for headwork since i already have it.... What compression ratio should i expect from flat tops and N47 head? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rturbo 930 Posted June 1, 2017 Share Posted June 1, 2017 Hey great infos again thanks! Ill probably send my current N47 head for headwork since i already have it.... What compression ratio should i expect from flat tops and N47 head? 9.8 if I'm not mistaken. Close to that, anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mforget Posted June 7, 2017 Author Share Posted June 7, 2017 UPDATE : since the begining of this build i am looking for a self tuning EFI option that would fit on my L28 and didnt found anything.... I have the FAST EZ-EFi 2.0 on my V8 LS track car and this thing is awesome. So i looked at FAST, Holley and FITECH offerings and found that their EFI throttle body kits would fit the L28 with the addition of an 4 barrel intake. I already talked to a tech at comp cams(fast) and he told me that it should work without a problem. I have to say that my experience is very good with the kit i have on my track car, i installed the kit, entered the base parameters, afr targets and the car was running at first start. Im tracking it for the 3rd season now without a single problem.... I highly doubt anyone got any experience with this on a L28 but ill ask anyway. Heres the kits in questions : http://fitechefi.com/products/30003/ http://www.fuelairspark.com/fas/ez-efir-self-tuning-fuel-injection-system-base-kithtml/ https://www.holley.com/products/fuel_systems/fuel_injection/sniper_efi/sniper_4bbl_tbi_kits/parts/550-511 Is using a 4 barrel intake and efi should give some benefits over the oem datsun intake and megasquirt? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BJSZED Posted June 7, 2017 Share Posted June 7, 2017 Take a look in the fuel delivery section Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mforget Posted June 7, 2017 Author Share Posted June 7, 2017 (edited) Take a look in the fuel delivery section Ho youre so right..... Great infos right there.. Sorry! But i am still wondering if there is any benefits performance wise over a megasquirt setup.... Edited June 7, 2017 by mforget Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mforget Posted August 7, 2017 Author Share Posted August 7, 2017 (edited) Thread revival Im about to start my engine work, i now have to choose a camshaft kit for my planned setup : 77' L28 with flat top pistons N47 head will be sent for port and polish to match my cam Aftermaket EFI will be used Stock intake manifold. Headers and exhaust will be installed. Will be doing mainly street and occasional track days with this car. Im likely to buy one of the schneider cam kits from zstore : http://www.thezstore.com/page/TZS/PROD/classic12e03/10-2000 So i have 2 questions : 1- Knowing that i will be using the stock L28 intake manifold, am i wasting money by going with a "big" cam like the 10-2005? 2- Stock injectors should be good for 200-250 hp from my understanding so no need to upgrade them right? Thanks in advance for your help! Edited August 7, 2017 by mforget Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turbogrill Posted August 9, 2017 Share Posted August 9, 2017 Thread revival Im about to start my engine work, i now have to choose a camshaft kit for my planned setup : 77' L28 with flat top pistons N47 head will be sent for port and polish to match my cam Aftermaket EFI will be used Stock intake manifold. Headers and exhaust will be installed. Will be doing mainly street and occasional track days with this car. Im likely to buy one of the schneider cam kits from zstore : http://www.thezstore.com/page/TZS/PROD/classic12e03/10-2000 So i have 2 questions : 1- Knowing that i will be using the stock L28 intake manifold, am i wasting money by going with a "big" cam like the 10-2005? 2- Stock injectors should be good for 200-250 hp from my understanding so no need to upgrade them right? Thanks in advance for your help! 1. Not sure but I woulnd't race past 6500 RPMs unless you have forged pistons, after market ignition and a really good balanced bottom end. Maybe it's ok for redlight racing but not track duty. 2. Stock turbo injectors might be but from what I understand the stock non turbo will fall flat before 200hp. I finished my megasquirt fuel only installation a few weeks a go. From someone that doesn't know anything about electronics or cars it might be a daunting task. But if you have worked with car electronics before it shoudn't be to bad. Time consuming for sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madkaw Posted August 9, 2017 Share Posted August 9, 2017 I'd budget in Megasquirt for sure and do fuel AND ignition . Regrind your cam- go big Find a mn47 head and get bigger seats put in and swap over intake valves from your head. Clean up short side radius and be done with head Pallnet fuel rail and run high impedance injectors Don't touch the bottom end - but you can look at with the head off and say- 'looks good' Clean up that engine compartment Put a header on later if you want noise Gearing makes for fun Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewZed Posted August 10, 2017 Share Posted August 10, 2017 2- Stock injectors should be good for 200-250 hp from my understanding so no need to upgrade them right? Will you be cranking up the fuel pressure? And running them at 100%? https://www.rceng.com/technical.aspx#Fuel_Injector_Worksheet_ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JavelinZ Posted August 10, 2017 Share Posted August 10, 2017 (edited) BRAAP had a really good efi induction FAQ type thread a few years back that had a lot of info. I don't remember what section it is under anymore. But it should be there. Stock NA injectors won't do it. Cam is a waste of money on stock L28 intake, intake is the first real restriction you run into, especially NA. Several guys with stock turbo engines I know made 230-240 hp on stock turbo injectors. Injectors were maxed at 240hp. NA injectors won't make it. Honestly a $2000 budget isn't going to get you 200hp pretty much regardless of how you cut it. I know of several people with builds along the lines of what you have pitched with triples and a cam and those cars put down about 130 at the wheels. If you want 200hp NA you're gonna have to give Rebello $10k from what I've seen of a rebello motor car that I thought was quick. Or you can run a turbo motor, an ecu, and z31 turbo and make 230hp and 275tq. At least that is what my friends car is running (it's faster than the Rebello motored car by the way) That's my two cents from what I have seen from several iterations of friends builds in town since I started into Z cars back in '08 If you want NA power I'd expect to basically throw all of that $2000 budget at paying someone that knows their way around an L head to work the chambers and the ports into shape and I wouldn't be surprised if it took more cash to get the head finished. Regards Edited August 10, 2017 by JavelinZ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mforget Posted August 10, 2017 Author Share Posted August 10, 2017 Hey thanks for all the advice! Yeah I changed my budget for the engine work! But budget is growing real fast for not much hp from my calculations.... Injectors question is answered, i will go for bigger ones.... Now you have me wondering again about that restrictive stock efi intake...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madkaw Posted August 10, 2017 Share Posted August 10, 2017 Not sure I agree that the intake is the weak point in the power equation. Also not sure a cam is a waste of time on the intake. As I have posted on my thread that power wise I can not tell the difference between the triple 40's I was running and my N42. Granted I was only running 32 chokes on the 40's, I believe with the proper tuning abilities you can probably get your dual purpose engine. There isn't a lot of guys actually doing hot NA EFI engines on here with aftermarket ECU. Most cases its a turbo version, so not a lot to compare to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mforget Posted August 10, 2017 Author Share Posted August 10, 2017 My plan was to use the z car depot ez-efi self tuning kit that they developped for the stock intake....but if the stock intake is a real problem, i may just put a 4 barell intake and ran an ez-efi electronic throttle body instead....i dont have patience to mess with carbs anymore.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madkaw Posted August 10, 2017 Share Posted August 10, 2017 Spending money on a different intake and TB is money you could be spending somewhere else. I'm running a 490/290 cam with my N42 just fine and I bet I get 30 mpg on the highway MPG. You are asking about a car you can drive to the track and back home then its all about tuning and YES-head work . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mforget Posted August 10, 2017 Author Share Posted August 10, 2017 Do you have any porting done on the stock intake? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rturbo 930 Posted August 10, 2017 Share Posted August 10, 2017 If you want 200hp NA you're gonna have to give Rebello $10k from what I've seen of a rebello motor car that I thought was quick. Did you mean to say 300hp? If not, that's blatantly wrong. It's not that hard to get 200hp from an L28. 300hp is a different story. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mforget Posted August 10, 2017 Author Share Posted August 10, 2017 Im still not ruling out the 4 bbl intake, considering i would have to buy a pallnet fuel rail, injectors, probably 60mm throttle body + z car depot ez efi kit....i could just buy the arizona z car 4 bbl intake and ez-efi throttle body kit and be done with it....cost would probably be similar...it probably flows a bit better as well....cleans up the engine bay....i dont know... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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