Zmanco Posted April 14, 2007 Share Posted April 14, 2007 I'm looking to change my rear pads to get more rear brake bias. http://forums.hybridz.org/showthread.php?t=116954 Since I also want to be able to use them on the street, I've narrowed it down to the Hawk HP Plus and the Porterfield R4-S. From comments on this site and the manufacturers descriptions, they appear to be rather similar in their performance and temp ranges. Since my primary goal here is to get more rear brake bias (which I will then adjust with the prop valve - currently all the way open), I'd like to choose the pad with the highest coefficient of friction. Unfortunately that information isn't on either manufacturer's web site. Does anyone know which one has a higher coefficient of friction? Are there any other pads I should be looking at? Edit: Could I get away with using the Hawk Black on the street if I only have them on the rears? Anyone tried this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrFancypants Posted April 14, 2007 Share Posted April 14, 2007 Is this primarily for the street with the occasional track use? Ive always found the Axxis MetalMaster Ultimates to be good everyday pads. They can also handle the abuse of the track. Their only downside is they dust quite a bit, but that comes with the territory. Not sure how they rank in your coefficient of friction comparison, though. - Greg - Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zmanco Posted April 14, 2007 Author Share Posted April 14, 2007 Greg, yes, mainly street with a few hard track days per season. I currently have the Axxis Metal masters both front and rear and except that there isn't enough bite from the rear, have been quite happy with them. Reasonable cold stopping and good fade resistance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjhines Posted April 14, 2007 Share Posted April 14, 2007 I have been using the Hawk Blues on the front and the Hawk blacks on the rears... I love the bias, but the disks wear as fast as the pads. $$$ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMortensen Posted April 14, 2007 Share Posted April 14, 2007 Metal Masters have to be the worst "performance" pad on the market, in my experience anyway. They consistently warp rotors and I had a brand new set that was properly bedded in start chunking in 5 laps. Had decent luck with the R4, but it's not really streetable IMO. The R4S is good for autox but that's about it. There is a pic in my gallery of the R4S pad I punched a hole in after the lining either detached from the back of the pad or got totally burned off at a track day. My next set is going to be either Blacks or HP+ pads, still not sure which. I think I'm going to be autoxing for a while so I'm leaning towards the HP+. Coffey used Blacks on the ROD and he had smaller brakes than I've got so I doubt I'll ever need more than the Blacks. From the reports my friends have given me the blues really eat rotors, although they work good if the pad temp is way up there... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
proxlamus© Posted April 14, 2007 Share Posted April 14, 2007 Daniel I ran Porterfield RS4's on my toyo front brakes last time with fair results when I was at Golden. I still have them on the car for daily driving. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrFancypants Posted April 14, 2007 Share Posted April 14, 2007 Metal Masters have to be the worst "performance" pad on the market, in my experience anyway. They consistently warp rotors and I had a brand new set that was properly bedded in start chunking in 5 laps. Which MM's? They have 3 different compounds: Deluxe, XBG and Ultimate. http://www.importrp.com/product.php?productid=54156&cat=0&page=1 http://www.importrp.com/product.php?productid=54157&cat=0&page=1 http://www.importrp.com/product.php?productid=54158&cat=0&page=1 I had really good experiences with the Ultimates specifically. Driven very hard on the track they didnt fade like I would expect for a "street pad" and were easy on rotors. Never warped a rotor with them. I have heard negative things about the regular MM's, but Ultimates have always gotten great reviews. - Greg - Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMortensen Posted April 14, 2007 Share Posted April 14, 2007 Last time I bought them I don't think there was a Kevlar option. They were just metal masters. Definitely not the organic ones. I think Axxis had organic and metallic back then. It was the pad that Nissan Comp used to sell, and man did it suck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
z-ya Posted April 14, 2007 Share Posted April 14, 2007 Try either the R4-S or HP+ in the rear for track days. On the street both pads are quire noisy and squeal quite a bit. I run the HP+ in the front and rear for track days (Wilwood forged superlights front, 240SX rear) with the prop valve all the way open in the rear, and the bias is quite good. For street I have some Wilwood T pads I run in the front (super lame), and KVR in the rear. This works well for the street, and they are nice and quiet. The Stillen Metal Matrix pads are the best pads I've used on the street. They are available for 240SX, and most likely for the the Toyo calipers. They are quiet, bite really well, and can handle occasional track days. I run them on my 350Z. Maybe you should try a set in the rear before your next track day. http://www.stillen.com/product.asp?id=MTLPADS01&c=BR Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
260DET Posted April 15, 2007 Share Posted April 15, 2007 Ultimates are a good all round dual purpose pad, not a full on race pad but they don't wear rotors like race pads do either, specially when cold. Ferodo 2500 have a good dual purpose reputation, I stuffed a set and think they are over priced but most others love them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zmanco Posted April 16, 2007 Author Share Posted April 16, 2007 I decided to try the Hawk HP Plus. Thanks for all the inputs everyone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikelly Posted April 16, 2007 Share Posted April 16, 2007 I personally don't think you'll be unhappy with the Hawks. They are a little rough on the rotors, but rotors are a "wear" item anyway, right? Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cygnusx1 Posted April 16, 2007 Share Posted April 16, 2007 Maybe off topic but could an adjustable proportioning valve help your case? It's not much harder to install than a full set of pads and shoes if you have the right tools. It will allow you to tweak your F-R bias to your hearts content. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zmanco Posted April 16, 2007 Author Share Posted April 16, 2007 I personally don't think you'll be unhappy with the Hawks. They are a little rough on the rotors, but rotors are a "wear" item anyway, right? Mike Especially with the 240sx conversion - you have to pull the caliper off to change the pads, and then if you're not careful, the rotor will literally fall off And to top it all off, a pair of rotors is cheaper than a set of pads. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zmanco Posted April 16, 2007 Author Share Posted April 16, 2007 Maybe off topic but could an adjustable proportioning valve help your case? It's not much harder to install than a full set of pads and shoes if you have the right tools. It will allow you to tweak your F-R bias to your hearts content.Actually, I already have an adjustable prop valve. The problem is that even with the valve all the way open, I have too much brake up front. My hope is to use a pad with a higher coefficient of friciton in the rear so I can start to use the valve to adjust the balance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnc Posted April 16, 2007 Share Posted April 16, 2007 I ran Hawk Blacks for the short sessions I raced the ROD. If I was running longer track sessions I would probably have run Blues or HT10s. Right now I had Porterfield cut me a custom set of Hawk HT10 pads for my 350Z. This compund has a good bite with excellent modualtion and release. I ran them on a 1992 LT1 Corvette for a little while. HT10s are is a bit much for a street car. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gnosez Posted April 16, 2007 Share Posted April 16, 2007 I took 1TufZ's approach and advise and put the HP+ in my 240sx rear calipers and so far I like how they seem to have balanced the braking (along with the prop valve) better than the pads I had in there before. I'm running AZ Z front Wilwoods with the street pads. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zmanco Posted April 28, 2007 Author Share Posted April 28, 2007 Success! Just finished putting the Hawk HP Plus pads in the rear. I'm still running the Metal Master Axxis in front. I've bedded them in and now there is enough rear brake with the prop valve all the way open to lock the rears before the fronts. I just need to adjust to get the fronts to lock first. Thanks everyone for all the inputs! I'm looking forwards to the next track day where I hope to have a little shorter braking distance Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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