Amazing tech...keep it non-political PLEASE

[cygnusx1]

 

I saw a few patrol cars with this system, cruising through town the other day. I had heard about it but never saw it. Pretty amazing.

 

Let's keep the politics out of this and look at the positives. Imagine your car is stolen. That's when you really want this technology on your side!

[The love of JDM]

Ive heard something about that on the History Channel, seems pretty cool but no so much for those who break the laws.

[Xnke]

It is pretty amazing tech, but it's also about a decade old tech. I've been installing cameras like this on buildings for years, hooked up to similar systems, for medium to high security building complexes. Usually installed on a guard shack, or on some locations, every single intersection within the facility. The system has always been EXPENSIVE. Like six figures for a 30 camera install, before labor costs. It's not the cameras that cost so much, or the computer, but the software licenses. I really see this as a specialty tool, like one or two cars per state. it's not cheap enough to install on every car, because the license issues would be enormous.

[strotter]

Though I'm not a car thief, I can think of a couple of ways, off the top of my head, to get around such a system, at least for a short while. Long enough certainly to get a stolen vehicle some place to disassemble it.

 

An article in Discover (I think) magazine a couple of years ago talked about the future of "smart" law enforcement systems. Much of the technology already exists, but is too expensive today. In the near future, maybe not. Imagine, for example, a device the size of a modern cell-phone attached to or built into a street sign or light pole. With its' built-in camera, it can both identify your vehicles' speed and photograph your license plate. Not too complicated an algorithm. When a speeding violation occurs, it calls home via cell to report the incident. A week later, you get a letter in the mail, big old fine. You could deploy these by the millions, on every road in the country. Bingo, speeding a thing of the past. It wouldn't take too much more digital smarts to identify stolen, uninsured, or otherwise "unacceptable" vehicles, as the system above. They could also determine if you didn't come to a complete stop at a sign, accelerated too aggressively, or otherwise behaved in some antisocial manner.

[Tony D]

With the technology advancement rate, it's going to be rendered moot through OEM advancements in ECU. They already have remote monitoring provisions in OBD3, and with some high line cars the ability exists already to disable the vehicle through remote means (say you miss a lease payment...)

All that needs to be done is the car with an ECU lock gets stolen, and the owner notifies the OEM branch that is set up to liason with Law Enforcement, and they can get a cel-phone location fix, and disable the car as it's being driven.

 

I don't see a 'need' for it, it was the Governmental Mandates that set up the OBD "Remote Monitoring" provisions in the protocols for 'future use'...what that 'future use' is, remains to be determined. But for me? I don't see any 'need' for it whatsoever.

[kiwi303]

Hmm... cameras on poles that fine speeders? got them already! too many of them too.

 

As to remote anti theft. there was some cop show that profiled an auto theft sting. some car of a popular to theives make is fitted with a GPS, radio remote lock override and ECU cutout, then parked in a high risk theft area.

 

Once the office gets a radio message from the cars computer they simply notified the nearest prowl car and sent a message back to the sting car. Locks clicked down and interior door handles disabled, and the ECU cut the engine and applied the ABS system to brake the car. Prowl car pulls up and radios the office to let the door lock release.

 

If I recall right, It got shot down by the American Criminals Liberties Union, or ACLU or whatever they call themselves as infringing Americans rights as a police sting parking a tempting car was providing temptation that otherwise wouldn't have been there.

[johnc]

Parking enforcement vehicles had these scanners for at least 5 years.

[big-phil]

bad boys, bad boys, what cha' gonna do?

[SuperPickle]

I think this is an excellent piece of technology that will make many people keep their collective noses clean! That said, there are some concerns:

 

1) LEO's may get a bit lazy. LEO's may simply pass on a verbal report and assume the suspect will caught by someone else down the road. If the scanner is only updated once a day, a vehicle that is stolen may have up to 24 hours to get gone.

 

2) The biggest flaw in any technical or security system: The human factor. The system's continued operating success is dependent on many compartments' accuracy. A typo by the programmer, dispatcher, underpaid data entry person or a false witness statement would result in somebody else getting the warrant. Also if any of the above accidentally mixes up two vehicles of a long list of updates (especially at the end of 3rd shift, the update time). This rolls into the next thought.

 

3)The system will have a reputation of infallibility and, once established, will be considered probable cause for a vehicle to be searched, detained, et cetera. This already happens today where you see somebody accused of something and believe them to be guilty simply because they were accused. This is also known as the "Where there's smoke, there's fire" mentality.

 

4) It can easily be thwarted using low-tech means. Swapping the plates with "known-good" plates from a similar make and model and removing the plates entirely spring to mind.

 

Before I get flamed:

 

Just to reiterate, I think it's a good example of law enforcement technology and fully support its use! These concerns are simply that! This is only my opinion based on years of working with military, gov, and LEO types.

[woldson]

Odd, in the USA, I thought they can not run plate #'s unless they have a reason.

I did note that this is in Canada.

The question always remains:

At what point freedoms stop and public safty begins?

 

As for my car getting stolen, I can always get lowjack, my choice.

[spotfitz]

All this adds is speed to already available means. In most major US cities, they can already punch your licence number in and see if you have insurance, valid registration, invalid drivers licence or warrants on said registered owner of the vehicle.

[SuperPickle]

Woldsen: Although I think I'm on the same side as your views, I have to disagree with your sentiment regarding this.

 

Like Spotfitz says, it's on public property in plain view. It's not protected by the 4th Amend.

 

EDIT: Also, I think we're toeing the political no-no line...

[rturbo 930]

Odd, in the USA, I thought they can not run plate #'s unless they have a reason.

I did note that this is in Canada.

The question always remains:

At what point freedoms stop and public safty begins?

 

As for my car getting stolen, I can always get lowjack, my choice.

I definitely see where you're coming from. However, insurance, etc. is something you need to have anyway... so unless you've got something to hide, no need to worry.

[Tony D]

I definitely see where you're coming from. However, insurance, etc. is something you need to have anyway... so unless you've got something to hide, no need to worry.

 

Well, that crossed into the political commentary, if nothing prior did!

 

I have to stop now on a reply, as there is no retort to that statement that can not come from a political viewpoint!

[rturbo 930]

Well, that crossed into the political commentary, if nothing prior did!

 

I have to stop now on a reply, as there is no retort to that statement that can not come from a political viewpoint!

I'm just saying, I would hope everyone on here has all that stuff up to date *shrug*

 

 

My bad if I just turned this thread into a political thread.

[Austenp405]

As stated, this is old technology. It has been in use in Colorado for years, and is specifically authorized by statutes. Since tags are in plain view, reasonable suspicion isn't required.

On a side note, the current system also runs a clearance on the registered owners and gets associated warrant hits. It is a common occurance to gather a group of 5-10 troopers and one of these systems on the side of the interstate. An hour later the operation will be over, simply because everyone that was working has made an arrest.

[PalmettoZ]

Though I'm not a car thief, I can think of a couple of ways, off the top of my head, to get around such a system, at least for a short while. Long enough certainly to get a stolen vehicle some place to disassemble it.

 

An article in Discover (I think) magazine a couple of years ago talked about the future of "smart" law enforcement systems. Much of the technology already exists, but is too expensive today. In the near future, maybe not. Imagine, for example, a device the size of a modern cell-phone attached to or built into a street sign or light pole. With its' built-in camera, it can both identify your vehicles' speed and photograph your license plate. Not too complicated an algorithm. When a speeding violation occurs, it calls home via cell to report the incident. A week later, you get a letter in the mail, big old fine. You could deploy these by the millions, on every road in the country. Bingo, speeding a thing of the past. It wouldn't take too much more digital smarts to identify stolen, uninsured, or otherwise "unacceptable" vehicles, as the system above. They could also determine if you didn't come to a complete stop at a sign, accelerated too aggressively, or otherwise behaved in some antisocial manner.

 

 

Hey-

 

When I lived in Germany back in the early 90's, this was already a very normal thing. There were certain areas that had cameras set up on the Autobahn (yes there are areas on the Autobahn that have speed limits) and a camera would photograph a photo of your plate as you zipped by going too fast. They would mail you a copy with a fine and you were required to pay it. Great idea and very effective at catching speeders. If you lived in the area though, you knew where the cameras were and usually remembered to slow down.