Tony D
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Posts posted by Tony D
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Exactly.
I would NOT run that head line to the inlet---that IS raising your overall temperature of the engine by taking water from the hottest part of the engine and shunting it DIRECTLY to the inlet of the engine---where it mixes with the radiator return line and warms it considerably! This is a PRIME reason many 240's overheat. That mixing should be limited to the internal 8 or 10 mm passage, and the external 8mm bypass line from the lower thermostat housing.
Think about this: The heater is a radiator and when the heater is 'on' and flowing water through it, it is cooling it therefore allowing NO increase in radiator water return temperature to the pump. When the heater is off, the bypass is OFF. NO FLOW!
On the 280ZX's they incorporated a poppett-style valve to open at EXTREME high rpms when the thermostat is closed, as the two 8mm bypasses are not sufficient flow to prevent cavitation of the pump when revved cold.
I would remove and plug that line IMMEDIATELY.
Then, I would consider either taking the 15mm line off the plug side of the head and shunting it directly to the thermostat housing...but usually the flow increase holes are added directly over the combustion chambers to allow any steam produced to vent 'up and out' as well as increase flow in that area directly out to the radiator.
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Yeah, let's make a quick and dirty plaster sand-casting of the thing and store the plaster postitives someplace. Then again, pourable high-durometer urethane would work better...
Yeah yeah yeah, let's do that!
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Normally the return line is up higher in the pickup well angled downward and tangential to any housing.
This insures that air bubbles go UP and away from the lower pickup for the fuel pump. Looks like you are set up for a dual-feed setup. I think moving your return to the top of the surge tank in the cel and pointing it down and in will eliminate the possibility of air ingestion.
If they (suction and return) are close to one another, or on the same level, any air bubbles coming down the return line can get ingested into the suction of the main pump.
The #75 IMSA Car Millen drove had six pumps and two surge tanks, each 4" in diameter and almost the height of the car! Something like 42" tall...want to guess where the fuel return was on those tanks, in relation to the suction for the main fuel pump?
About 40" vertically above the suction point!
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Good Question, but my inclination is to say "no"...
Honestly I can't remember what the door came from that I put onto my red 2+2, I am almost positive it was from a coupe, but can't positively recall.
I could measure external dimensions I suppose. They're sitting next to one another right now...
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You could get in contact (PM him here) with Frank280ZX, he is in Utrecht.
He will have a container shipping to Rotterdam or Amsterdam late in June as I have been told.
He's busy building his S130 for the Time Attack at Zanvoort first week in June. Matter of fact, I have to go UPS Red his bearing set to him right now...
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Why is this not a sticky?!
The sticky is in my head...."there were two posts about rear cylinder cooling"
LOL
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Niiiiice!
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Frankly, the term he was thinking of was 'integral' not really external.
The pump on the L-Series is integral, as opposed to external.
While it may be 'external' to the oil pan, it's most definately not an 'external' when you use the proper terminology of 'integral'---which is the differentiation between an integral pump and an external like a Dry-Sump setup that is belt driven.
Even now, there are dry sumps being worked up to be integral to the sump, so they are integral with the block assembly, while not really 'external' in either of the previous interations.
And the run of the L-Series pump goes a bit further than the NAPS-Z, check out your local KA engine....Why do you think 'high volume, high pressure' L-Series pumps are still in the pipeline while all the other parts wither on the vine?
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I wondered where you were today...
Maybe time to get some more coolant flow out to the back two cylinders. My CHT sensor (what I use on the MS) reads about 20 degrees hotter going down the road than the one in the thermostat housing .
Didn't hear anything, did you! Damn it sucks when it goes like that. Better the head gasket than the pistons.
And people called BS on me for a 2 hour unassisted head gasket change! LOL
On the Octane Police, I know CA and MI have them. Matter of fact right now my standard stop, the Flying J in Frasier Park is on the hook for 4 engines at least after a load of bad gas. They had an announcement on the evening news (local) for anybody with engine problems after filling up there to notify the station for reimbursement if they can prove it happened after their fillup (not to hard, really).
In Michigan, Sunoco sells (and I don't know who would buy this stuff) 84 Octane SUB-Regular! Talk about a big "D'OH!" on your turbo car if you mistakenly punch the wrong button on THAT pump!!!
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Really Randy? I thought you were a Ford Tech. Are you doing motor pool work, or something else.
"PM me" you have piqued my curiosity...
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Yeah, I guess the 'proper answer to the question' is that the 10K tachs were in the Z432's.
Thanks for the manual Eric! Now I know all the gadgets in my 71 as well!
Curiously, the 'flash to pass' button they show in the '432' section was in my 'mystery car' S30-110661, a 240-Style Body with all the "PZR" floors, flash to pass light on the signal switch, but no 'PS30' as the chassis code says it should have....
That switch is now in my current 71 Fairlady Z. "Flash to pass" in an early S30 is soooooo cool!
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If you're going to run the turbo, run a big one, turn the boost way up, and get more power. Deal with the lag, and forget about trying to run more compression with a lower boost turbo. If you want no lag and big power, get a V8. Maybe I'm oversimplifying, but that's my quick and simple advice...
This is my 'Freeze Plug'...
Using a larger turbo generally results in a higher Boost Threshold, meaning full boost will not be realized until a higher rpm.
This is not the same thing as 'lag'!
Lag is the time it takes for the compressor, once given a WOT situation, to come onto full boost. This time is so quick in modern turbos as to be almost immeasurable (if that is a word).
People get conditioned to drive 'on the cam'---and this is supposed to be acceptable in an N/A engine. Yet when you go WOT on a cammed engine at idle you get soggy response (V8's included). Run it up so you are 'on the cam' and go WOT and you get instantaneous response.
It's well known you have to drive a Cammed N/A engine 'on the cam' for proper response.
This is no different than a TURBO engine. Yet, apparently slapping a hairblower onto a car is supposed to magically transform the engine into an 'all rpm performer' and ignore the basic laws of physics.
Drive a turbo car properly, and there will never be an instant where you will notice 'lag'---that went away well before the 70's were done and the 80's came along.
Now, having been in JeffP's car, I can say his engine runs like a much larger CID simply because his engine breathes so well. Sure, you only get 3psi at WOT from 1000rpms, but the dyno will show it pulls linearly from there on up. Sure, you feel the torque peak pull harder at 4500, just like any cammed engine, but you really don't feel a surge at 3400 rpm when the boost goes like a switch from 3 to 20psi. You wouldn't think the curve would stay as flat as it does with boost jumping so quickly, but it does.
The current generation of turbos are not what terms like 'Lag' were meant for...
Maybe I'm missing something, or misinterpreting it, but "lag" from the above quote looks like a mis-driven old-school turbo setup.
Drive even an old school turbo setup properly, and 'lag' really isn't an issure either.
And driving it properly means keeping the r's above boost threshold, same as when you drive a heavily cammed engine.
As for the detonation issue, I agree. I don't know what 'drivability' issues you were having with the stock P90, but raising the compression probably didn't accomplish much other than giving you another headache. I run a Non-US N42 and have run that to 17psi, but that's not with dished pistons. I think you messed with a working combination and learned the hard way theory sometimes does not work in the real world.
Did your 'drivability' issues get any better after the head swap. Did you feel the difference you thought you would? If not, that's a good indicator to go back the way you were. It's only a couple of hours work and another couple of gaskets. Sucks when experiments don't work out.
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Depending on the size of the I/C, as long as your keeping the discharge of the I/C above 120F, you can spray quite a bit into the inlet and not worry about precipitation post-cooler.
But with the injection, the I/C usually becomes redundant as the latent heat from the vaporisation of the anti-detonant performs a similar fucntion as cooling the airflow with mechanical/physical means.
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Regarding Daeron's comments on page 12.
I would agree that 'flow straighteners' would be a technically more correct term to use. When I originally saw 'vortex generators' I read this as generating a vortex as in their design. This is why definition of terms is so important and semantics more than a pedantic exercise. If people don't understand what you are trying to say, then you all loose a lot of time chasing stuff because of misunderstandings that need not be.
Similarly misapplying a term can lead to similar things...Technically the items Monzster put into the manifold are decidely not vortex generators. I forget the proper aerodynamic term, 'strake' or something other. VG's are generally at an oblique angle meant to disrupt airflow over a wing, not really to channel and straighten it. VG's are used to great effect in general aviation aircraft in lowering speeds the aircraft can fly with stability with higher angles of attack on the main wing surface.
Splitting hairs? It's exactly why definition of terms is always the first section in any technical paper...
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The stock manifold is far too much of an impedance (runner diameter) to even bother with modifying.
That was why JeffP limited himself to simply extrude honing it and smoothing it out a bit. It was recognised it would be the necking point on his system, and is really restricting his output right now. He's only making 600Hp, so if you are shooting for more than that, to be sure the stock manifold will probably really prove to be an impediment.
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Without a plenum? Would the runners go strait into the TB? Cnat really picture this..
Take a look at some of the newer Toyota Manifolds, they look just like that: a set of Tube Headers with a T/B stuck on the 'collector flange' and made of aluminum instead of steel.
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Really, as long as you have a linkage with little or no play, the TPS can go just about anywhere in the system. Inside the car on the throttle pedal pivot point is nice and clean, and cool, and doesn't mean you have to open the hood to connect to it for troubleshooting. Only if your linkage breaks will it go kaflooey...and in that case you won't be moving anyway.
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Oh oh, the word it out! Sarah the Webwatcher at Nissan Sport has us listed on her "Sarah's Hot Topics" on the Nissan Sport webpage.
Well, I didn't admit anything illegal, I paid money to get on the track and have the speeds verified. The rest of you giving time deates and photos on the other hand....
Muahahahahaha!
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Measure Twice, order once. Then assemble just to check again!
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Yeah, my eyes are set on that R230 in the high 2's. With a 3.36 I can play with tire height to get a variety of gears, and then for the long course, the 2.9 setup can go in there for real long legs.
Somewhere a 3.08 falls to mind, but 3.15 works as well I suppose.
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Oh yeah, the week I got to turn in the company truck, a nice shell shows up....
DAMN!
You are the devil, Eric!
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When I hooked up mine for the MS, I used a 300ZX 3-wire, and wired it into the fuel pump relay circuit. It is only getting power when the fuel pump is running.
I used the Z31 connector, and wired it according to the Z31 FSM wiring diagram, meaning the signal had a shielded wire back to the ECU, with the other two being power and dedicated ground.
I will have to check into that current limiting resistor JeffP mentioned, I have never seen excessive draw, but it may be wise to limit current downstream by such a method.
I hooked it into the Fuel Pump circuit because I only want power on it when it's running. If you were worried about power draw on existing circuits, it's simply a matter of putting another relay into the circuit, and using the fuel pump power wire be the one that triggers the 'heater circuit relay' you install with a direct line from power to the sensor (through whatever current limiting resistor you deem appropriate) and then on to it's own discreet ground.
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I ran the small housing for years. On the auto-X I was at 17psi at 1700rpm at WOT. It was more like a supercharged car than a turbocharged cars.
It was ALL DONE at 5500 though. Short shifting was a way of life. But for what it was, it worked fine. If I was gumptious, I would put a larger external wastegate for a separate bypass at higher RPM and use a larger compressor wheel...but you got to be careful with the smaller wheel working that big wheel.
But yeah, for Auto-X it was a hoot.
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The LeMons car used the 8X8 map from above.
Instead of using the MSQ, take a look at the maps, and simply enter the values into your Megasquirt. It may not be a downloadable 'plug and play' but you can populate the maps really quickly, and even if the engine is not the 'same' there is great lattitude in the tuning...it will run, you just may need to run some tuning runs to clean it up where the peak torque area changed. Above there and below there, there is WIDE lattitude in the tuning and what will run.
Head cooling on cylinder #5 - solutions?
in L-Series
Posted
Bo, I answered your questions in yoru other post, before I saw your PM.
The heater hose is a direct shunt, and allows engines to potentially overheat.
The flow answer is to tap above the head and return it directly to either the radiator, or the thermostat housing.
The water pump imparts velocity to the water, and restriction along the way creates the pressure in the block and head. It is this increased pressure (up to 60 psi on the bottom side of the thermostat at higher rpms!!!) that keeps the nucleaic (give me a break on spelling---reference the grape ape racing document on cooling and how engines overheat for the correct spelling of the term) boiling from starting. It's not just the static pressure from the radiator cap. What the cap pressure does is insure there is sufficient NPSH at the pump inlet to operate correctly at variable speeds that can wing that thing up to VERY high speeds. One of the problems you get is pump cavitation, and a higher static pressure helps with that...but when the engine is cold you can cavitate when you rev high simply because no pressure is built up in the radiator yet, and the lower radiator hose can 'collapse' from the suction.
Really, the only time there is real 'suction' at the water pump inlet is before warmup. Once the coolant expands and you build some static pressure against the cap, the pump in merely imparting flow to a system that gets pressure from restrictions along the way.
Adding flow to one section may indeed rob flow from another...TimZ's post about the OEM Nissan LD28 pump (or was it JGKURZ...) as it has a larger impeller and fits our front cover.... So if you plan on modifying the flow on the head, I'd consider that upgrade as well.
Take a look at what I wrote on the other post...feel free to copy and post to this thread if you feel it's appropriate.
I'm jumping all over! BLaaaaah! Walla Walla Walla...