R200 short nose / long nose and VQ37VHR?

[SlippyD]

I'd like to run a VQ37VHR engine in my 78 280z.

 

Here's my question, if I purchase the swap kit, and hook up the VQ37VHR engine, and the transmission that comes with it, is the R200 a viable diff? As long as I do the conversion for the diff swap first, will that set up work?

[Zetsaz]

Your car should already have an R200. What do you mean by conversion for the diff swap?

[SlippyD]

Should already have an R200? Then why do t3 sell the conversion kit for them? Maybe I missed something?

[ZHoob2004]

IDK if it was the same in the 78 as the 77 (it probably was) but the automatic cars came with an R180 rear diff.

[Zetsaz]

R200 is an R200. Some years/options had different gearing when you get into the ZX especially, but if your car is manual you already have a 3.54 ratio R200. If you're looking at making it a limited slip that's a different question, but as far holding the power in something that will just be on the street, you're already there. R200 holds plenty of power. The T3 conversion is mostly for folks with a 240z which all came with an R180, or those looking to use a short nose R200/R230 and make it bolt in from Silvas/240sx or later 300zx cars. 
 

R230 is probably overkill. For reference, 230mm is just over 9" which is even more than some guys with dedicated drag setups run. Unless you're planning on going turbo, your best bet is to just find an R200 LSD to bolt in in place of your current one, or doing an OBX or Quaife LSD. Both you can find plenty of info on by searching the site. Honestly sometimes more than you'd care to know. 

 

See chart:

http://www.zhome.com/ZCMnL/tech/GearRatios.html

[Neverdone]

Man do I hate how Nissan didn't choose to re-name the short nose R200...

 

1) You've obviously gota be talking about the shortnose R200 that came with the Q45/350z/370z. This is because your car currently already has an R200, albeit a longnose R200m which has a completely different carrier, and in the 280z, was an open diff.

 

2) The only question anyone should be asking is, "What do you mean by 'viable'?"

Will it work? Yeah.

Will it break? Not unless you're gonna be putting way more power then what came stock and using some incredibly meaty tires.

Is it the best diff you could use? There is no best.

 

3) Technotoy tuning sells a conversion kit to use the shortnose R200, which also uses custom uprights to use plug-in axles, as opposed to a stub axle+companion flange set up which the S30 came with. There's lots of befits that that rear end conversion also brings, but it's at no small cost. If it is worth it or not is completely up to you. 

 

That should answer the questions you were asking.

[260DET]

What Neverdone said,  as far as reliability goes the weak point is the bits between the R200 and the wheels.

[thoughtful_edit]

I know this post is a couple years old @SlippyD but just wanted to add my 2 cents. Couple reasons to run a shortnose diff. 1 availablity the older long nose r200 are getting harder to find. 2. Stub Axles. With 280z stub axles, when they break, your wheels roll off into the sunset and you probably end up in a ditch or wall or tree, etc. The S14 hubs stay on if the axle breaks. Considering how much money and time I have dumped into this car it is a small price to pay for that piece of mind. Some people run really expensive stub axles that help with the breaking issue but if for some reason they did break your in the same boat. 400+ HP and a lot of torque I am running the t3 swap with q45 shortnose, the t3 axles and s14 hubs.  (kind of the same answer as above but with a bit more detail.)

[NewZed]

11 hours ago, thoughtful_edit said:

Couple reasons to run a shortnose diff. 1 availablity the older long nose r200 are getting harder to find. 2. Stub Axles. With 280z stub axles, when they break, your wheels roll off into the sunset and you probably end up in a ditch or wall or tree, etc.

 

You're confusing hub axles with diff axles.

[thoughtful_edit]

10 hours ago, NewZed said:

 

You're confusing hub axles with diff axles.

I am actually not. Stub axles connect to your wheels. Diff axles connect to your diff. You can also run CV joints which does not resolve the issue of the stub axles. That is what I was running before I switched. Stub or hub axles are the weakest point. Replace axles with CV Joints, then replace stub axles with heavy duty billet chromoly or just switch to t3 r200 short nose kit where the wheel hubs bolt to the mount. If the axle breaks they do not come off.   

[NewZed]

The diff has nothing to do with a wheel falling off.  If you think it does you're confused.  No offense.

 

 

[NewZed]

22 hours ago, thoughtful_edit said:

Couple reasons to run a shortnose diff. 1 availablity the older long nose r200 are getting harder to find. 2. Stub Axles. With 280z stub axles, when they break, your wheels roll off into the sunset and you probably end up in a ditch or wall or tree, etc.

 

Explain how a shortnose diff affects a wheel falling off differently than a longnose diff.  For your own edification. 

[calZ]

It doesn't directly, but almost no one swaps shortnose diffs in without the corresponding switch to S14/Z32/Q45 hubs. 

[thoughtful_edit]

On 5/28/2022 at 8:37 PM, NewZed said:

 

Explain how a shortnose diff affects a wheel falling off differently than a longnose diff.  For your own edification. 

Exactly what calZ said... I understand where you are coming from. Theoretically you could build a mount and connect s13,14 hubs to a long nose diff. The r200 is a strong diff short or long nose. The parts hanging off of it are the failure points. If I decided to connect a old style stub axle to the short nose r200 same issue.  I'm just saying you can alleviate those failure points with the t3 kit. The s14/z32/q45 hubs mount to a bracket then the axle goes in to the hub (if the axle breaks the wheel stays). The older r200 uses the stub axle as the mount which is held together with a big bolt and some bearings. Then the axle is connected to the stub axle. Stub axle breaks wheel goes. 

 

Per SlippyD's 2nd question. "Then why do t3 sell the conversion kit for them? Maybe I missed something?" Neverdone gave some detail as to why you might want to switch. Stub Axles are one of the main reasons for me. Wheels falling off at high speed is the kind of stuff I hate.  

[NewZed]

On 5/31/2022 at 10:54 PM, thoughtful_edit said:

Theoretically you could build a mount and connect s13,14 hubs to a long nose diff.

 

Defend this calZ.  Good luck.

 

Here's a drawing to assist in the discussion.  #1 is commonly known as the "diff".  #6 is the wheel, or hub, axle.  #7 is commonly called the half-shaft.  It connects the diff axle shaft to the hub axle.  Where the wheel mounts should be obvious.  Let's see where this "mount" would be installed. 

 

Edited June 2, 2022 by NewZed
Added some words.

[calZ]

You could build a mount (spindle/backing plate) for new hubs and connect them to the long nose R200. That wasn't a very difficult translation.

 

The OP mentioned wanting the T3 swap kit for the R200, failing to understand he needed to specify he was talking about the short nose. Thoughtful_edit is adding that a big benefit to choosing to do the swap kit is that you get rid of the stub axles, i.e. OP goes with the diff and he gets more benefits than it holding the power of the VQ37. 

 

Are you being willfully obtuse or just pedantic because you want to be right? You're one of the most knowledgeable people on this whole forum, but you have a habit of trying to condescendingly demonstrate your superiority to new members and "put them in their place." That usually drives them away, and in the age of Facebook, we need all the members we can get here. 

[NewZed]

The car will roll and corner and brake and absorb bumps with the differential completely removed.  This would require a hill or towing, of course.  There is no functional connection between the differential and the wheel axles.  You could install a Ford 9 inch or a long nose R200 or a short nose R200 or an R180 and it will have zero affect on the probability of a wheel falling off.  The only connection between the wheel axles and the differential are the drive axles, aka half-shafts.  There is no "mount" that would serve any purpose in connecting the differential and the wheel hubs.  The cars have independent rear suspension.

 

Thoughful_edit resurrected an old thread and made an absurd comment.  Why are you trying to defend it?  It makes no sense.  The differential will have absolutely no affect on the probability of a wheel falling off and the car crashing in to a stone wall.  Gibberish.

 

The purpose of the forum is partly education in addition to entertainment.  My original short comment was meant for education.  I really did not expect such resistance to understanding how things work.  As far as being "willfully obtuse", well-done on the grammar, but I think that you're projecting.  It's actually a bit scary when somebody keeps repeating nonsense and seems to believe it.

 

 

[calZ]

1. The OP asked if he should go with the T3 shortnose swap kit

2. People replied that the long nose would probably work as well

3. Thoughtful_edit added his support for the swap kit because it comes with the additional benefit of getting rid of the stub axles. 

 

That's a very clear path to follow. 

 

19 minutes ago, NewZed said:

The car will roll and corner and brake and absorb bumps with the differential completely removed.  This would require a hill or towing, of course.  There is no functional connection between the differential and the wheel axles.  You could install a Ford 9 inch or a long nose R200 or a short nose R200 or an R180 and it will have zero affect on the probability of a wheel falling off.  The only connection between the wheel axles and the differential are the drive axles, aka half-shafts.  There is no "mount" that would serve any purpose in connecting the differential and the wheel hubs.  The cars have independent rear suspension.

 

He was acknowledging that you could theoretically swap in hubs without changing the diff, but that the kit does that and more. He's used "mount" to refer to the hub/backing plate assembly three times now. Would backing plate be a better word? Yes. Is it still easy to follow what he's saying? Also yes. 

 

Both Thoughtful_edit and I understand how the whole assembly works. We both own the T3 kits and have removed our own rear suspension and replaced it with a short nose setup. Neither of us are confused, you're just latching onto one sentence without any context and hammering it into the ground.