Driving -101

[cygnusx1]

After hearing what happened in Mike Kelly's family, my bitter feelings towards distracted driving have been re-kindled. I always tell my passengers that they can talk to me while I drive but I might not talk back, in fact, I might not even hear them. The reason is that, when I drive, 100% of my attention is going towards driving. I don't know how I learned the habit but I know it works. Talking on a cell phone while driving for me is totally out of the question. I am sure there are people that claim it can be done and that they are not distracted. I claim B.S. Sure, some may be better at distracted driving than others but you only find out how good you really aren't when it's too late.

 

I always drive with polarized sunglasses during the day. Even if it's cloudy and bright, or even rainy, I usually use them. The polarized glasses seem to make puddles stand out from the asphalt better in the pouring rain. Anyhow, with polarized glasses, you can see very clearly, the faces of drivers through their windshields. I am amazed that during my AM commute, I see at least 10-15% of the drivers with phones held up to their heads. Mind you, I am driving in a state that bans hand held cell phone use while driving. Out of those 10-15% I usually catch 1-2% showing warning signs of dangerous driving. Tailgating, riding the double yellow, two wheels in the dirt, struggling with the wheel with one hand.....it is downright scary. One thing I notice in ALL of them is a distant look on their face. They are NOT in the moment. Even the drivers that use hands-free technology are not ALL there.

 

Is there anything that can be done? We are a large group, and the internet contains an even larger, collective group of driving enthusiasts. What can be done? Let's at least try to do something about distracted driving. It's obviously a HUGE problem. A REAL driving education system needs to be implemented.

 

 

Anyone who plays online driving games, knows what happens when your spouse or someone starts talking to you while you race. You either crash or you get passed.

 

http://www.unews.utah.edu/p/?r=062206-1

http://www.consumeraffairs.com/news04/2006/04/cell_phones_distraction.html

[JMortensen]

There are already laws against failure to control a vehicle. The answer is to enforce the laws. This is already bordering on political, so don't be surprised if it gets shut down very quickly.

[cygnusx1]

Funny thing is that I am sooo far from being political or PC. I just can't stand incompetent driving.

[naviathan]

I'm sorry I have to chime in here. I drive with a cellphone. These days it's kind of a must. I spend a lot of time on the road for hundreds of miles a week. I'm not a trucker or a professional driver of any kind, I just have a busy schedule through out the week. I use my cellphone with and without a headset in the car and I use it through my intercom system on my bike. I have no issues with multi tasking while driving. Most people in todays society don't. Accidents are usually caused by other distractions on the road or just plain stupidity. If a cellphone or someone talking to you distracts you that much while driving, I'd be afraid to be on the road with you simply because if anything happens that takes your attention in the least you'd probably loose it.

[JMortensen]

Funny thing is that I am sooo far from being political or PC. I just can't stand incompetent driving.

I don't see this thread going anywhere other than "there ought to be a law". Your call for some sort of action on the part of the collective car lovers of the internet foreshadows some sort of petition or other device to at the least "raise awareness" of the dangers of driving while using the cell phone and that would be political.

 

Most political issues are not purely political. They become political when people attempt to take action to change the status quo. Notice that I haven't shut the thread down. I'm just warning against it going where I think it's going. There are plenty of other forums where you could take this subject head on and it would be totally acceptable. If it gets political here it will get shut down. Nothing personal.

[cygnusx1]

I think the thread can remain civil and driving related rather than political. I know that driving attention required varies alot from region to region. I personally can multi-task, but I choose not to include non-driving tasks while driving. I don't have a need to use the cell phone while driving and my opinion reflects it.

 

It's just scary. I am sure this has happened to everyone. You glance away from the road for a second and then you look up to see a stopped car, or your car is near the edge of the road, or there is a car in your lane coming at you. It happens. When it does, I want to be 100% ready.

 

I am always looking for hidden trooper cars, I am anticipating other drivers, I am keeping mental locations of the surrounding traffic, driveways and intersections. I am looking for deer and other anomalies. I am also categorizing other surrounding drivers as threats or non-threats by their driving style. So far I have never so much as scratched a car in 20 years behind the wheel. Knock on wood. No, I don't drive like a granny, I drive aware.

[2126]

I believe many people just take driving for granite......! Driving is generally pretty easy to do but does require focus, which many violate by using cell phones, talking to passengers, fixing their hair, and many other things that should be done before or after a drive. We all need to remember, it's not just yourself involved while driving but everyone around you who is driving as well. It seems that plain old common courtesy has become exstinct and it's now all about the probervial me!!! Personnally, most so called accidents are not accidents at all but, just a lack of driving focus and in some cases just plain old stupidity! Let's all just try to be a little more cognizant of our fellow drivers. Having good SA (situational awarness) does prevent accidents.

[dsommer]

So let's talk about best practice driving then. You bring up one point that I truly believe in, the polarized sunglasses.

 

I always drive with polarized sunglasses during the day. Even if it's cloudy and bright, or even rainy, I usually use them. The polarized glasses seem to make puddles stand out from the asphalt better in the pouring rain. Anyhow, with polarized glasses, you can see very clearly, the faces of drivers through their windshields.

 

You can see SOOOO much better, in the rain, fog etc. with polarized glasses, I would recomend everybody pick a pair up and give them a try, you'll be amazed at how much more you can see.

[JMortensen]

So let's talk about best practice driving then. You bring up one point that I truly believe in, the polarized sunglasses.

 

 

 

You can see SOOOO much better, in the rain, fog etc. with polarized glasses, I would recomend everybody pick a pair up and give them a try, you'll be amazed at how much more you can see.

Agreed. I wear mine all the time here in Seattle and my wife thinks I'm nuts, but it really does help.

[kilten_one]

If they make them in clip on form I will look into picking up a pair for myself, though when shopping for polarized bring a polarized lens with you to check to make sure it truely is polarized. just place them up to each other so you can see through them both and rotate one untill you can no longer see through it.

[EvilC]

Agreed. I wear mine all the time here in Seattle and my wife thinks I'm nuts, but it really does help.

 

Really I have to check this out......always thought people were nuts wearin glasses when it is cloudy or rainy out.

 

Learn something new everyday.

[cygnusx1]

Really I have to check this out......always thought people were nuts wearin glasses when it is cloudy or rainy out.

 

Learn something new everyday.

 

 

Who say's we're not nuts?

[datsunlover]

I wear lightly yellow colred polarized safety glasses at work, (machine shop) for simmilar reasons. In a dimly lit shop or a factory, it helps me to see clearly and things stand out. Most of my 'out of shop' jobs are in very buisy industrial/manufacturing settings, and you MUST be aware of evrything around you at all times. Press's are moving, automation/robots flying through their cycle, tow motors driving by, people yelling, and I'm ussualy VERY close to something moving or rotationg. Actualy, a lot of my work is BUILDING the saftey guarding so when I'm working, the machine/ect is wide open and quite dangerous! (at a ceartian point, I will ask that the thing is shut down though, I'm not crazy)

 

I know most people would class themselves as 'above average drivers' but seriously, I do.. I've avoided hundreds of near accidents, and I have only had ONE crash in 12 years of driving. 100% the other drivers fault (they ran a stop sign right in front of me) and the cop even told me he was suprised it wasn't worse.. Heavy trafic, cars evrywhere, and I managed to stay in the lane and only hit the car that ran in front of me. 'creative braking' I guess.. (my truck skidded out to the left at oncoming traffic, and at the last second I let off and got it straightend out and then re-aplied the brakes just as I hit the honda square in the rear quarter.)

 

I agree that people (for the most part..) just don't take driving seriously anymore.. the 'zoned out look' you see on people's faces, the poor reaction time and then obvious panic responce of slaming the brakes and swerving.. My girl friend sad to say, is one of these people and I think it's just the way it is.. some people just should NOT drive!! I regularly take whatever I'm driving out to a parking lot in the winter, and see what it will do.. (and what I can do!) In the summer, 2 or 3 times a month I find a backroad and practice threashold braking/heal toe downshifting... And I'm sure it has kept me alive a few times!

 

Three things I've learned basicaly sum up what I conseider to be good driving practice;

 

1; Always assume the other people on the road don't know you're there.

2: Drive as if you have NO brakes (more-so for driving in the winter)

3; Be compleatly aware at all times of EVRYTHING around you. That includes the guy 4 cars back trying to pass evryone, and the guy turning left 2 cars ahead, ect... IE; always be looking for an 'escape' route or something soft to run into!

[Michael]

All of us are incompetent in our own little ways; if we had laws banning stupidity, most of us would be incarcerated for life. The scary part is how modern technology can both magnify the effects of our incompetence, while simltaneously shielding us from its immediate obviousness.

 

I too get annoyed when drivers swerve, brake at the last minute, devote more attention to their phone conversations or to disciplining their children or fondling their pets than to the task of operating their vehicles. But it seems to me that being on the road is, fundamentally, a risk. By getting into my car I implicitly agree to subject myself to the flaws and failures of my fellow drivers - as they agree reciprocally to mine.

 

It is however worthy of mention that our society is tremendously dependent on automobiles for routine transportation; no civic reengineering plan could possibly alter that. It's the fact that we live in our cars that raises the odds of horrific rarities to the point where we each know some one who has suffered catastropchically in a motor vehicle. But - callous as it may sound - perhaps this is the "disease" of our times. Centuries ago it was plague or tuberculosis; for us its car accidents.

[Gollum]

One thing I'd like to say about the phone subject, is that I tell people on the phone the same thing I tell my passengers, "If I don't respond right away it's because I'm driving and I might ask you to repeat yourself."

 

If you're on the phone you're not AS equipped to handle surprises, it's a simple fact. Less of your brain power is being focused on the road.

 

Now, you CAN keep enough attention on the road while talking to drive under 100% favorable conditions with no surprises. Some people have a hard time in a 90% favorable condition, such as rain. But I guarantee you that nobody is gonna be talking on the phone if an accident just happened right in front of them.

 

Our issue here is that it doesn't take much to keep a car on the road and drive "acceptably". It takes much more to drive safely and with full awareness. 99% of the time when I'm behind someone and they're doing something stupid enough to force me to pass (even on the right side if I have to, which I don't do unless I must) they're one the cell phone. Sure, I know many people here can probably drive just fine with a cell phone, but we're car nuts that love driving.

 

I'd venture to say that MOST drivers if on the cell phone won't be able to respond well enough if an emergency arises.

 

I've personally had enough close calls while OFF the cell phone. I've learned that there's a time and a place for it while driving. And even then you don't take it lightly. I generally only answer a phone call on the road if it's someone important and I keep it short. I can understand business people needing to talk much more than that, but I think most people still take it too lightly.

 

But then there's all the other stuff I see. Girls not looking at the road while they do their makeup. Kids not paying attention just chatting it up with their friends. Mothers fighting with their kids in the back seat. Men carrying such insane loads on their vehicle that are so poorly tied down that they spend more than half their time looking in their mirrors and not in front of them.

 

All these people MIGHT be able to avoid an accident, that's not what I'm getting at. What I'm getting at is that they MIGHT be in an accident they COULD have prevented under other circumstances.

 

I think the reason we don't have more accidents is because of all the people that ARE paying attention. The person that's not on the phone that leaves room for the person that IS on the phone trying to merge without looking. Or the trucker that moved over ahead of time for a short on ramp that everyone thinks they can take at 40mph. I many times break "speed laws" on the on ramp because I'm trying to carry as much speed as possible for merging (anyone who's seen some of the vallejo on ramps here in the bay area knows what i'm talking about).

 

I'm also really big on driver awareness. Spot the people that cause trouble and know how to prevent trouble. Learn how to drive in SPITE of them. Don't make them worse than they already are. Find GOOD drivers and follow them. The other night I managed to get behind 3 consecutive cars going the speed I was (close enough) that all treated the last lane as a passing only lane even though traffic was super light (1am, but there's still people out of course). So I followed all of them all night because I knew they were actually paying attention to what they were doing.

 

Sure we could say there's lots of ways to 'fix' all our issues, but we don't need this getting political since most of the laws we need are in place, they just need to be enforced. So that's that for that subject. I have no need to quarrel over politics or even discuss them.

[z-hag]

what datsunlover said and then some!

 

as for distractions while driving----there are those of us who are able to multitask and there are those of us who are not able to multitask. the problem is understanding, when one is not as multitasker, that talking on the phone and driving are two separate tasks.

 

same with men shaving their beards on the freeway and women putting on makeup at the red lite and while driving on the freeway.

 

there are many gripes, but the reality is , although many can mulltitask without leaving a wake of death and destruction, there are those who cannot.

 

carrying on a conversation for many many miles versus using the phone for directions or answering business calls are different uses of the cell during driving. the useless conversations between those who are not able to handle multitasking is what seems to be the problem with cell phones and cars. so, who decides what is useless??? it is not always practical to pull over to use the cell. there are neighborhoods in which that action in and of itself is a suspicious action.

common sense is also a limited comodity. it is not learned, yet it is taught--

enforcing too many laws will completely limit actions of citizens and create a more limited society-----

and i received those who did not do so well in the meeting of the cars for 30 years. it isd not a pretty picture what a car can do to human--with or without another car to protect -----we all say we are perfect--so, then, WHO is it that is making all these mistakes if we are all indeed perfect??

 

what datsunlover said.....and gollum........

[Guest Westby]

Well there have been several studies showing that driving with a cellphone ( handsfree, speaker, it doesn't matter ) is equal to or worse than driving drunk.

 

http://unews.utah.edu/p/?r=062206-1

There are several other studies ( a very good one coming out of the uk ) which I'm sure you can find thru google. They all point to the same thing. It's not the use of the cell phone, it's the conversation. Here's an excerpt from the study:

 

Motorists who talked on either handheld or hands-free cell phones drove slightly slower, were 9 percent slower to hit the brakes, displayed 24 percent more variation in following distance as their attention switched between driving and conversing, were 19 percent slower to resume normal speed after braking and were more likely to crash. Three study participants rear-ended the pace car. All were talking on cell phones. None were drunk.

 

Now I don't know about you but I have been run off the road multiple times ( while driving a bright orange car mind you ), cut off when towing vehicles, and everything else under the sun, and 99% of the time it's some wanker on a cell phone that did it. Personaly I notice when I have used a cell phone my driving does suffer. On long stints of 9hrs + I have been guilty of being on the phone but I avoid it in town at all costs. Forgive me if I come across harshly but this is just one of those things I feel strongly about.

 

Take it easy.

[cygnusx1]

Monday morning, I was driving to work on a road with one lane in either direction separated by a double yellow. It's a 50mph rural road. There was a car behind me that looked like an older Honda with a young male driver in it. He was keeping a good safe distance about 20-30 cars behind me. I was keeping my eye on him because 1)He was young 2)The car looked a little beat-up. After about 3 miles he got on his hand held cell phone. Within seconds, he was riding my back bumper and yapping away with a distant look on his face. I slowed down to about 40mph for his sake, to buy him some reaction time. The road is notorious for cars coming out of driveways and intersections by surprise. The change in his driving was completely and obviously changed by the cell phone conversation.

 

Amazingly, on the way home Monday evening, I had a young girl tailgating me by about 12 feet through a 30mph residential area. She was on the phone also. I was driving about 40 when she caught me so I slowed down to about 30, again, to buy her reaction time in case I had to brake.

 

These types of drivers won't learn until they get into an accident. Even then, they may not learn.

[JMortensen]

You want to know what the most dangerous distraction I ever experienced while driving was? A gigantic bumble bee flew into my helmet while I was going top speed on my dirt bike and freaked out inside the helmet until it finally made its way over to my ear and stung me. In turn, I slammed on the brakes, shifted from 6th to 1st and let out the clutch and crashed hard, went over the bars, the whole 9 yards. Maybe we should begin a massive bee irradication program...

 

There are far to many causes of bad driving to write laws to "protect" us against them all, even if that were a good idea.

 

As for your study Westby, here's another you might want to look at: http://www.aaafoundation.org/resources/index.cfm?button=cellphone

 

And here's the quote I'd like you to take note of:

While a cellular telephone conversation is no more distracting than a conversation of the same intensity with a passenger, the availability of a cellular phone is almost certain to increase significantly the number of conversations in general and the more distracting, intense, business conversation in particular. Older drivers, in particular, should be cautioned against placing calls

Maybe we should ban passengers. Or ban "intense conversations". Or maybe we could enforce the laws that we have already established for safe driving. That would be nice, huh? I see people doing stupid crap all the time. You want people to follow the rules? Enforce them and provide penalties for breaking them. Cygnus mentioned tailgating. I don't know ANYONE who has EVER gotten a ticket for tailgating. EVER. Anyone heard of someone getting a tailgating ticket lately? We are seriously lacking in the enforcement department.

[johnc]

Some misconceptions here:

 

1. Human beings cannot "multi-task." The term is used incorrectly when referring to how human brains handle multiple tasks at once. The cognitive part of the brain can really only focus and do one thing at a time. Human beings are reasonably good at task switching (quickly moving from one task to another and back) but doing two things as once is not possible with cognitive part of the human brain.

 

http://www.apa.org/releases/multitasking.html

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15225042/

 

2. A number of studies, including the unscientific test on Mythbusters, show that cell phone use while driving a car is dstracting and can be severly distracting to the point of driving impairment along the lines of driving while intoxicated.

 

"One thing that definitely happens when you start overlapping tasks is even if your performance doesn't suffer, your memory suffers," says Hal Pashler, a professor at the University of California, San Diego. "If you talk on the cell phone and drive to work, you don't crash the car, but you may forget where you parked it."

 

Personally, I have made a big effort to stop talking on a cellphone while driving. I don't place calls anymore and I'll rarely pick up the phone if someone calls me.