strotter

Isn't the striker different 240 vs 260?

Dave, they will swap over, sort of. The various pieces are all in *slightly* different positions. I.E., the 280 window crank opening is about 1" aft of the 240 position. Most of the original opening is covered by the circular base of the crank, but a bit of it peeks out from under. My solution: a circular plastic piece that snugs tightly onto the shaft, covering the 1/4" gap. The door opener close-out (the little well the handle is in) is off by about 1/4", upward and aft. Similar solution, but made of aluminum sheet painted black. Not visible unless you're looking for it. The armrest is a different story. As I recall, *one* of the screw-holes correspond to the 240 panel, though all the old holes are hidden. I just drilled openings in the panel with a 1/2" hole saw, marked the sheetmetal underneath, then drilled two holes for both: a 1/4" one for the screw to pass through, then a larger 1/2" hole immediately next to it; I dropped a self-capturing speed nut from the larger hole to the smaller and used a self-tapping style screw to fasten. Finito! The door-lock is also in a different position - I believe it's 1" or so forward. I just got manly with the connecting shaft to line it up, but it was necessary to cut a hole in the top of the door frame for it to pass through.

I put a hybrid 260/280 interior, including all the plastic trim pieces around the cockpit and the door panels, into a '72 - the original being orange-red and in rough shape, the newer black and in good condition. The newer pieces are quite a bit heavier moldings but nevertheless fit well. Two exceptions: first, the area above the suspension arches has a cut-out for the shoulder belt inertia reel. Though I haven't done it yet, a simple flat plastic panel could fill the area neatly. Second, the openings for interior door fittings are in slightly different positions - the window crank and door opener are slightly aft and upward respectively. The armrests are of course entirely different, being of a different design, so none of the holes line up to anything in the 240 door, but you can use the newer style armrests and just get crazy with a drill and jigsaw.

I had the same problem with the U-joints in the steering shaft - just worn out. As I recall (and this has been a couple of years now) they are 10mm i.d., 15mm o.d., a bearing is hard to find for some reason - at least, my source couldn't find them for a rebuild. I was considering having the whole thing machined oversize for 16mm o.d. bearings, which are apparently everywhere but lucky for me, I found a 280 at the junkyard with a good U-joint and went that way. Determining if they're bad is tough, because they're so small, and the slop so tiny, it takes a *very* delicate touch to feel it. Also I found that the presence of grease can "mask" the slop. Note that the bearings are just staked in place - easy disassembly with a Dremel or similar tool.

OK, here's more. Lots of these people online seems to know somebody else who has a car that can [insert ridiculous performance behavior here]. 800 hp, 10-second quarters, 200 mph top speed, etc etc etc. However, very few people seem to actually do with these cars what is implied in all these stories: that is, actually drive the car around *as if it were a car*. A car, that is, a street car, has to do a few of things to earn that name: it has to run reliably (within limits), it has to transport a person from point A to point B on a near-daily basis, and it has to be in a condition such that, if pulled over by the local P.D., will be found to be safe enough to continue on its' way. I have the impression that many of the vehicles we hear about on the 'web (and occasionally here on HZ) are what were referred to in the past as "trailer queens" or "garage queens", the former meaning it was pretty but didn't roll, the latter meaning it was so overbuilt it rarely made it onto the street. Both conditions disqualified the vehicle as a "car". BACK IN THE DAY, when someone made a claim to some kind of performance, it was generally while they were standing in front of the car - and thus such a claim could be immediately tested. As a matter of fact, the claim *itself* was an invitation to test. I'm thinking back, way way back, and remember this clearly. Saying "My car will run 12.5" would generally garner an immediate reply of "OK, let's go!", and off we'd caravan to some pitch black and seldom travelled back road where we'd find out if it really could run an 12.5. Needless to say, people were loathe to make claims they couldn't back up - and repeatedly making such claims garnered that person title of "squid", which nowadays around here refers to motorcyclists of a certain type but which then referred to somebody who made exaggerated or extravagant claims. If ever somebody said "I know this guy that has this car that'll ... [ridiculous claim]...", somebody in the crowd (usually me) would pipe up with "Well it ain't out here, so bulls**t." If the car wasn't there, or if somebody in the immediate area hadn't seen it in action recently, it didn't count. This automatically eliminated garage queens, professional drag cars, unreliable overbuilt machinery of any type, the lot. If it couldn't get itself out to the local drag, run up and down the street for a couple of hours without overheating, and *then* perform some miracle of backyard-manufactured performance, it wasn't a car, it was a story. And nobody had any respect for a story. There was a built-in cynicism which is critical to differentiating "awesome fact" from "total bulls**t", something which seems to be distinctly lacking from many of the younger or more naive gearheads I come across. Much of what I see on the 'web has the aura of Urban Myth. Yeah, I'm sure some guy got 600 hp out of his Celica - but did he then drive that car to work for the next six months? If not, it's a garage queen. Heck, I know of guys that get 10,000+ hp out of old-fashioned American V8's - they're called "Top Fuelers", but they only do it for 4 seconds. They're not *cars*. URF!

OK, a bit of a followup here - I've been looking around the 'web for information about rebuilding Honda motors - something like a "Tips and Tricks" for Honda motors, things to watch out for, common mistakes, that kind of thing, in case I can't find a really great deal on a used motor. So I searched for "Honda/engine/rebuild", then "Honda/rebuilding", then "D15b7/rebuild", so on. Checked lots of variations on that theme. But, 99.9% of what I came across was total, well, crap. Forums with questions like "If I take out my air filter, will my car be faster?" (followed by quite a bit of serious discussion with *no* resolution), websites selling things that will gain you "30 HP WITH 10 MINUTES WORK!!!!!!!", plenty of clothes and seat covers and tinting kits and wheels - lots and lots of wheels! It was depressing. Also, it seems that only a real pussy rolls with less than 300 hp, duh, and anyone with half a brain can (with only a bit of care) generate 500, 600, 700 hp out of their less-than-2-liter mill. Seriously. *And* drive it to work every day, for years and years. *AND* get 35 mpg (if they're careful). I suppose I'm just spoiled - by this site (thanks guys!), by my background and education, by my age (pre-internet youth). Perhaps I'm just being intolerant, but the whole thing just makes me feel cynical - and it makes me feel sorry for the guys just coming up. I mean, without an accurately calibrated crap-o-meter, how are these guys going to pick out the worthwhile stuff? How can they calibrate said tool when just about everything they come across is waste? And how long are they going to have to work to toss the B.S. they'll inadvertently pick up in the process of finding TEH goods? Their road will be much more difficult than mine. Turning wrenches has been a source of income for me (briefly, some years ago), a huge money-saver, and an endlessly fascinating pastime. In this age when communication is more easily available to anyone than ever before in history, it's reprehensible how little *good* information is available. I'm definitely going to work this thing into my classes.

For primary structural members - most especially those that have high-consequence failure - I'm always concerned about partial vs. catastrophic failure modes. There's no plastic deformation mode for carbon-fiber. That is, say you're driving down the road at high speed and hit a rock. Metallic wheel, you'll get a elastic (ductile) failure, the wheel is bent, there's lots of vibration, you slow down and complain. Composite wheel, you hit the rock, catastrophic (explosive) failure, carbon fibers and resin all over the place, you have no wheel, you're in serious trouble. It's one of the reasons engineers designing military aircraft like metals for primary structures: put a cannon shell through a metallic structure, there's a slim chance it'll survive. Cannon shell through composites, no chance.

JM, I'm way ahead of you on this - I'm thinking this may be one of those "teachable moments" - when something unexpectedly interests the kids, you strike while the iron is hot and teach something worthwhile without their even knowing they're being schooled. After all, a great deal of car stuff is about thinking things through clearly, applying some simplifying principles, and maybe using some formulas appropriately. Math (my subject) is about thinking things through clearly, applying some simplifying principles, and maybe using some formulas appropriately. A bit of logic, a bit of inductive and deductive reasoning, perhaps a demonstration or two... Maybe I can talk my principal into letting me bring the old motor down to my room ... We can start with a little nomenclature, then a few days on measurement, segue into tolerances, perhaps a couple of days on some simple thermodynamics (coordinate with the physical science teacher on that one), a day or two on strength of materials, maybe a little industrial design exercise ("design an intake", "dimension and illustrate the distributor", "design a go-cart using this motor/tranny", things like that). Hmmm. This might actually turn out to be a huge thing for the class of '97...

As some of you may know, I'm a schoolteacher in a continuation high school in Stockton, Ca. I commute to work about 25 miles round trip, and have recently been doing so in my '72 Z/350/T56 (as my freebee Intrepid died). Surprisingly, the Z has been a pretty good everyday car, given the quality of my workmanship and the temperament of the motor. Last week, however, I picked up a '93 Civic coupe which will, after a motor replacement, be the "car de jour". I've always thought they're handsome little putts, well built, reliable as taxes and economical to boot. Perfect for the everyday grind, with *air conditioning*, mmm, a/c... The reaction among my students, especially the wannabe gearhead types, has been - explosive. Spectacular. Nuclear. Did you know, for instance, that you can make a Civic run 10 second quarters, top 200 mph, and drift, all for hella cheap? Hella cheap! You can put NOS on it hella easy, and that'll make it run 12's, and you can put a cold air kit on it, and that'll make it run 11's, and you can put an intake on it, and then it'll run 10's. And of course 20's, 'cause that'd be just cool, and 'cause the bitches will dig 'em. Did anybody here know about this? Why haven't you told me? I feel like a fool, chasing horsepower with things like camshafts and fuel injection systems and headers and displacement, for goodness sakes, when all I needed was some NOS and a cold air kit and whatnot, and I can have it all, including the, um, you know, ladies. So now I guess I begin a new chapter in my life, now that I have something decent to drive.

I actually took an ad out in the local paper offering the motor/trans "running well, free to a good home". Got several calls, but each of them wanted me to do something heinous - one guy wanted me to deliver it to him, another wanted me to set it up so he could hear it run. Ended up taking it to the dump, paying an extra fee 'cause it was toxic or something. Sigh. I suppose no good deed goes unpunished. W/ regard to the Fiat, I'm surprised the L24 fit into the engine bay - those things are fairly tight with the I4, no less an I6.

I have a '72 with JTR mounts all around, T56, no lowering plates, and I guess I just got lucky but I'm vibration-free. Comes from living a good clean life, and flossing. There *is* some vibration, but it's proportional to RPM, not speed or load - it's more about cheapo motor mounts than drivetrain alignment. The wire-rope around the diff is one of those "looks dumb but works good" things, IMO - and of course it's a last resort, in case of broken components and diff swinging up & down wildly.

OOh, those blue ones look handsome. You're aware that it's possible to "reface" the gauges? I did this myself and have been pleased. Check this site: http://www.newtier.com/graber/z-car/gauges.html. I used white acetate in a laserprinter.

Yeah, that sounds right to me, too. Without control of the Vintage Air clutch, your ECM can't predict the increase in load; but the ECM can't know when to trigger the clutch w/o input from the a/c pressure switch. Basically, you need to give the ECM total control over the a/c system - which means you'll have to "bastardize" the Vintage system, run the pressure switch to the ECM, run the controller to the ECM, whatever. If you were using a similar really, really similar to the stocker, that would be for sure a great solution, but the Vintage system may behave differently than the stocker, or at least differently enough that the ECM won't be able to operate it properly. Your call. I'd *suspect* it'll work OK, but you may have to get into TunerCat and change some constants somewhere - and I don't know if those locations have been determined for the $EE mask. You may have to find a hack and get into it with a binary editor. Time consuming, maybe. Personally, I like burning up huge amounts of time for teeny little benefits; it's a side-effect of working on a Hybrid Z project. BTW, I was just thinking by turning off all the tests, you'd be able to avoid error codes. P.S: about the ECM increasing RPM for A/C operation: most of them do, but not necessarily by a lot - the mask I'm working with now adds a whopping 25 RPM with the A/C on.

Bart, the only thing I saw for your ECM (the 16181333) was "IAC Offset for A/C Anticipate Vs. A/C Pressure". Seemed like an odd name, so I checked into it a little. Seems the idea is that the ECM maintains the "base" idle with or without the A/C on - it uses the IAC to do this, of course. However, there's a finite period of time required for the motor itself to respond to IAC changes, so even under perfect conditions there'll be a momentary stumble each time the A/C cycles on and off (and I'm supposing we're only talking idle here). Thus, the "anticipate", which opens the IAC *just before* the A/C clutch closes, preventing the stumble. Your problem is that the ECM isn't able to control the clutch, so it can't predict the load, thus a stumble each time it closes. Your IAC will catch it after a moment, though, 'cause it senses the drop in RPM. Hmm. The only solution I can think of is to just shut off all the A/C diagnostics, A/C Low Charge Diagnostic, Error 61 A/C Press Sensor Diagnostic, Error 66 A/C Press Sensor Diagnostic, Error 67 A/C Relay Diagnostic, Error 68 A/C Clutch Diagnostic, Error 69 A/C Clutch Relay Diagnostic, Error 70 A/C Evap. Temp. Diagnostic, Error 71 and possibly modifying the values for Fan 1 On High A/C Pressure Threshold Fan 1 Off High A/C Pressure Threshold Fan 1 Disable MPH, High A/C Pressure Fan 1 Enable MPH, High A/C Pressure Fan 2 On High A/C Pressure Threshold Fan 2 Off High A/C Pressure Threshold Fan 2 Disable MPH, High A/C Pressure Fan 2 Enable MPH, High A/C Pressure and live with a little stumble. Can't hurt to try. If worse comes to worse, you can just revert the mask.

Bart, what ECU are you using? Most of the GM units have a "A/C Request Signal" input line which goes high when you close the a/c switch. At that point, there'll be something like "RPM Added, A/C on" in your mask (which may or may not be available in TunerCat, depending on your ECU). Factory numbers are typically small, <50 rpm. At the same time, the ECU will trigger your secondary fan ON.

As someone who is currently moving from TBI to MPFI, I can tell you that, in terms of performance, everything else being the same (and here I'm thinking airflow), they're - different. Tuning a "wet manifold", per TBI, causes the system to behave much like a carburetor, in that there's a fuel charge present even after you've shut off the injectors. This is most evident in transitions on/off throttle. "Dry" manifolds, per MPFI, have no such behavior, making them (perhaps) more controllable under those conditions. That said, there's a lot to be thankful for with fewer components. For my swap, I installed a Holley StealthRam and a new computer, a GM '7730, so I'm having to learn a new (and much more complex but complete) environment. BTW, the car is no faster (at this point) than it was with the TBI, but I have a *lot* of tuning to do.

It's also possible the latch mechanism is worn, maladjusted, or just plain loose. Also the dried out old wire running to the window heating element can make an annoying noise. I have a rattle somewhere in the hatch, I think with the little "finger" on the pivoting part of the lock mechanism. My rattle is caused by awe-inspiring nerve-destroying bone-rattling horsepower, but a speaker might do it, too. =)

Part of the problem with this thread, and the "cost of hybrids" conversation in general, is that we're talking about a few related but differentiable things simultaneously, but not delineating where each topic begins or ends. In particular, we're talking about four things: 1) putting a different-than-stock motor in a car that was not designed to accept it; 2) building a performance-oriented powertrain; 3) restoring a classic car to near-or-better-than factory levels, and 4) creating a custom-looking car. When someone says "hybrid swap", those who have been around the block have all four things pop into their heads simultaneously. The topics are related and intertwined, certainly, and require careful language to keep clear, but are in fact entirely different subjects. When I was doing my V8 swap, I at one point tried to reorganize my costs spreadsheet to differentiate "swap" items, "restoration" items, "customizing" items, and "operating costs" items: the idea was that I could prioritize purchases so as to spread the costs out evenly over the time of the swap. Later I broke "customizing" into "performance" and "pimpin". Interestingly, after I was "done", the "swap" items were the cheapest, consisting only of the JTR kit, the radiator, the driveshaft mod, fuel delivery components, exhaust, and a couple of other things. The donor car was about free. Most expensive? Restoration. I spent $320 on Nissan rubber weatherstrip, for God's sakes! Paint (did it myself, still $1k+); tires, upholstery, carpet, interior parts and pieces, glass, wiring, relays, the list goes on forever. Easily the most expensive part. Both were part of the "swap", for me, but not necessarily for everyone. My point is that, when we have this conversation, we need to be clear that the posts stating "it cost me 800 dollars to do the swap", and "I sold my house and two children, and it still isn't done", aren't talking about the same thing.

I don't drink very much, but there is nothing, absolutely nothing, as cooling, as satisfying, as *perfect*, as an ice-cold beer on a sizzlin' hot day. It's the only reason I look forward to summer.

When you're looking for ECUs, you'll have your choice of a number of different units. My personal favorite, and one that is well understood and well documented is the 1227730. It can run a variety of "masks", or control programs, including the excellent $8d - probably the best-documented ECU mask there is. Mostly used on Camaro/Firebirds and Corvettes, it was also used in a number of other cars including: 1987 2.0 L4 TBI “1†LL8 1988 2.0 L4 TBI “1†LL8 (early) 1987-89 2.8 V6 PFI “W†LB6 (exc. “W†body) 1988-94 3.1 V6 PFI “T†LH0 (exc. “W†body) 1990-92 5.0 V8 TPI “F†LB9 1990-92 5.7 V8 TPI “8†L98 (“F†body) (from http://www.cruzers.com/~ludis/p4xref.html ) AUJP1350 90-92 V8 TPI, 1227730 AUJMV 89 5.7L TPI Camaro automatic BAFL 93 LT1 TPI Camaro automatic AZTY 92 3.1L MPFI Camaro "T" AMAS7004 2.8L Auto ASMJ0692 88 Beretta/2.8L/Speed Density ADRY2642 87 Cimarron/2.8L/DigDash/Non-SD ADRY3193 87 Cimarron/2.8L/DigDash/Non-SD ARDC4468 88 Cimarron/2.8L/DigDash/Speed Density ADRR3163 87 Corsica/Beretta 2.8, 3spd auto, Federal emissions, 3.18:1 final drive, without Z21 The easiest to find is the Corsica/Beretta - I gave $25.00 last time I picked one up at Pick 'n Pull. For your V8 application, you'll also need to get the Memcal for your particular motor, or something close. GM Parts Direct has them for about $45.00 (last time I checked). You can find harness diagrams all over the place, a good one being http://chevythunder.com/ Good luck and have fun.

BTW, the external pumps aren't noisy if you use rubber-isolation mounts. Mine was driving me crazy, then I found rubber isolators (I think from some Harley supply shop, but they're available lots of places). Now I can hear it if I *listen* carefully when I first turn the ignition on, but there's no way I can hear it when the car's running (and I have "neighbor-friendly" mufflers on).