palosfv3

Just food for thought . They also fit well in these.

Most Zinc based primers or epoxies are a bright green or yellow green in color. The Datsun factory applied no internal anti-corrosion measures , similar to todays new autos, during manufacture. The process wasn't refined or used until the late 1980's. Zinc coated sheet metal is a relatively new material.

If the top coat is brakeing away from the primer/sealer, it will continue to do so unless the entire topcoat is removed. There is no easy way to strip the engine compartment. You may get lucky at the PBE store, they made a aerosol topcoat stripper for the early 90's GM delamination issue on the Corsicas and Berattas. It should still be available and was designed to only removed the color ( sometimes it also took the primer ). Its hard to tell the extent of the problem from the pics. If I had to venture a guess on the cause , the top coat may have been applied beyond the sealers application window.

2003 Cavalier More pics at picasa link below signature.

1998 - 2003 Cavalier 2 door weatherstrips work very nicely. About $45.00 ea at you local Chevy dealer.

Not all booths have heated air make up units and hobbyists tend to use whats available. Reducers and activators are temperature sensitive. If its a 100 outside you now have a whole different enviromental situation than if your spraying at 70. They dont make booth air make up systems with a/c ( at least here in the midwest ) . So you will need a very slow reducer/activator to get things to flow out and flash correctly. Flash times and clear/reducer/activator selection are important . Applying too much too soon can result in the top layer of the CC drying and trapping solvents below , which can lead to solvent pop or gloss die back. In colder weather situations similar issues exist with unheated spray areas and unheated air flow systems. Most urethane catalysts will not cure below 45/50 degrees and for every ten degrees below the optimum dry temp you may expierience at least a doubling of the curing time. Most will not cure in temps below 40. A little experiment to prove the point . Take 8 to 12 oz of properly reduced and catalized clear. Split evenly into two sealed mixing cups. Put 1 in the fridge and leave the other in an area with a temp of 65 plus. You will have you answer in the am. As far as reducing all catalized materials are ready to spray when mixed according to the recommended ratios. Over reducing is not recommended. It can mess up the internal crosslinking of the materials and create issues later down the road. Catalized paints are not like the old solvent based systems . You should not bartend these newer materials as they are ratio sensitive , some more than others. But not to worry, just as everyone figures this out the fun folks at the EPA over the next 2 years are bringing waterbourne paints to a place near you.

Please reread the P page info posted. It explains the what is and is not included. Is 10 hours heavy for an exterior refinish ? Depends on whats being cleared and the formula . Are you CC the inner fender aprons , the underside of the hood, core support. cowl , hinge pillars, hatch jambs , ect. 10 maybe heavy for an exterior CC of a Z, but you will spend at the least 4 to 5 hours. Heated booths do not affect flash times unless outside air temps are below 60 degrees. Flash times will depend on the reducer / activator used. When refinishing a complete you will want to use a slower speed reducer / activator ,so that the paint flows out nicer ( less orange peel ) and minimizes solvent entrapment. All in all you can debate the issue as much as you like to , its a matter of what you want for a finished product and how long you want it to last.

How did ten hours become twenty?

Refinish Procedure Clear Coat/Two Stage Refinish First major panel or soft bumper/fascia cover: Add .4 per refinish hour (40%), then add .4 per refinish hour for jamb, jamb and interior, edge panel, and/or underside (when necessary). Additional panel(s) and/or other refinish area(s): Deduct overlap (if applicable); add .2 per refinish hour (20%), then add .2 per refinish hour for jamb, jamb and interior, edge panel, and/or underside (when necessary). Included Operations Included Operations • Mix material • Clean and tack surface • Apply material • Clean equipment nnnnnnnnnnnnn NOTE: Some OEMs now utilize a matte clear coat on non-exterior colors applied to undersides, edges, and/or jambs. • Clean and tack surface • Apply material nnnnnnnnnnnnn NOTE: For NEW, UNDAMAGED PARTS, a total of no more than 2.5 hours should be necessary to perform the four Clear Coat Refinish Included Operations listed above. This calculation DOES NOT APPLY to bumper covers, ground effects, special package equipment, interior edges, jambs, entryways, undersides and additional time that may be required for repaired and/or used panels. It DOES NOT APPLY to complete vehicle refinish. It is not intended to determine the quantity or cost of materials required for the application of clear. Collision Estimating Guide (P-Pages) © 2008 Mitchell International, Inc. All Rights Reserved Three Stage Refinish First major panel or soft bumper/fascia cover: Add .7 per refinish hour (70%), after time has been added for jamb, jamb and interior, edge panel, and/or underside (when necessary). Additional panel(s) and/or other refinish area(s): Deduct overlap (if applicable); add .4 per refinish hour (40%), after time has been added for jamb, jamb and interior, edge panel, and/or underside (when necessary). Included Operations Included Operations • Mix pearl/mica toner • Apply toner to test panel • Mix clear • Clean and tack surface • Apply clear to test panel • Repeat application to surface being refinished • Clean equipment • Apply pearl/mica toner • Clean and tack surface • Apply clear nnnnnnnnnnnnn NOTE: With three stage paints, it may be necessary to blend into larger areas of adjacent panels or complete sides of vehicles, otherwise known as zone painting. nnnnnnnnnnnnn NOTE: Some OEMs now utilize a matte clear coat on non-exterior colors applied to undersides, edges, and/or jambs. These are the pages that apply to a C/C or tri coat clear application. The number for the CC aplication is an approximation of the calculation that would be derived from the formula. This number should be used a guide and is not gospel but in some circumstances could be realistic , especially with tri coat colors. While the CC page talks of limits of CC to 2.5 units, jambs and interior areas are not included and need to calculated separately.It also states 2.5 units is not applicable to complete or overall refinishes. CC aplications also need to take into consideration if the car is being painted assembled or apart. To mix a cup of clear, properly clean the spray gun ,clean the work area and put the unused items away will take at least 15 to 30 mins. How could anyone mix and apply 2 to 3 coats of clear ( approximately 6 to 7cups of mixed clear materials) , with the proper flash times, to a complete car in 15 minutes .

I posted this on another paint thread . This should answer most questions. January 26th, 2009, 09:39 AM #8 palosfv3 Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: chicago Posts: 100 Its interesting to listen to opinions of what a paint job should cost. The comments reflect personal standards , financial affordability, knowledge variables. Now add into the mix condition of the car, color , and region and you get some complicated data to sort out. Lets look at some basics that should be considered. Time study guides (flat rate book ) .There are posted times to paint each panel on a Z. These times are based on painting a new undamaged panel and are a good reference point to start from. If you had a new replacement fender for your car the book states it should take 2.5 hours to prepare and refinish the exterior of the panel and .5 hours to paint the inner edges. All panels of the car have a time assigned to them. Hood exterior (2.6 ) Door w/jamb (3.3) ect. There are corrections allocated for overlap and ad ons for getting exterior panels to the condition of a new part. Once the total time has been calculated industry standards apply a dollar amount per paint labor hour for materials and color. Flat rate time for painting all new condition panels is around 35 hours. This time also reflects a car that is apart and requires no masking. It doesnt include the engine compartment or other interior areas. Now add the time to remove the old finish , Many believe this is not necessary . This statement only shows ones inexpierience of the correct process. Any finish over 10 years old should be stripped. You're only throwing away good money and will jeopordize the lifespan of the new paint. Figure about $900.00 to $1200.00 to media blast the body. Be aware that this will not emove any rust. Paint and material costs will vary depending on several things. Basecoat/clearcoat paints are more costly than single stage enamels. Reds are more expensive than whites and black. Pearls and tricoats are most costly than metallics. Good automotive paints ( DuPont, Sikkens , ect.) are significantly more costly than fleet paints ( Nason, Matrix. ect.). We have seen reds and orange pearls on standard late model colors at $500.00 plus for a gallon of basecoat. Yes , many will complain that that is just way to expensive but that is the going rate , if that is the color you want. I'm not going into what the body work would cost to restore each panel to new condition as that could take a long time to explain but plan at least 1/2 to 3/4 of the cost of painting minimum. Quick recap Refinish exterior panels 35 hours @ $$$.$$ per hour Rates can vary from region to region ( $45.00 to $ 95.00) Add labor for Clearcoat 10 hours @ $$$.$$ per hour Paint Materials $25.00 to $40.00 )per paint labor hour . Additional Clearcoat materials same as above. Color sand and buff can vary depending on desired finish . Figure between 12 to 20 hours @ $$$.$$ per hour. A quick add of the numbers runs a range of around $3500.00 for a quicky paint to about $9200.00 on the other side. This upper figure doesnt represent a show finish where the entire car would be water sanded with #1000 paper and recleared and buffed a second time to get an orange peel free finish. If your talented , have a work area available for an extended time and have lots of time on your hands, you can do this yourself and limit your expenses to basically material costs and your time but you wont get a quality professional job for $3000.00. Best Regards __________________ Larry http://picasaweb.google.com/wgmauto http://www.wgmauto.com/

Hemisperical heads go way back into the early 30's with Alfa and MG.

Instead of using the how I did it version. Here is a link to how its done in the shops today. http://www.i-car.com/pdf/upcr/procedures/cp/cp01s.pdf

Last seen roaming Chicago's NW suburbs.

Go to www.metalmeet.com thats where all the metal shapers hang out. It a really great site.

Opps . didn't post the first time .

Instead of pulling on the quarter panel, get a porto power and some 12 to 18 inch 2x4 s and jack across the inner wheel housings inside the well. You will pick up a more space and cause less damage to the outer quarter if your careful. Here are the pics that didnt post . Tried to edit but no luck.

P275/40R17Toyo Proxes on 17x9. Wheel openings are slightly flaired and rolled. Its a tight fit alot of work and parts but everything does clear.

Try this link http://www.i-car.com/html_pages/technical_information/advantage/advantage_online_archives/2005/041805.shtml

It appears the front plate outer upper mounting hole for the compressor is on a different plane than the rear hole. This is resulting in the compressor being at the angle in the picture . This will cause the car to break or throw the fan belt.

I believe plastic mediablasting uses a different type of delivery system than a conventional blasting system . Media uses high volume low pressure .

2003 Cavalier 2 door door opening weatherstrips work well . You only need to make 1 angle cut at the top corner of the opening . About $50.00 each at your local GM distributor.

From time to time I like to read these types of threads . They remind me of all the trials of learning paint and body work. Things that will make your next efforts easier and better. Strip all the old paint off the panel. Your hood appears to have been painted at least 3 or 4 times. Why spend all the time , material and effort on a questionable surface. By removing the finish you eliminate many of the common issues of lifting , cracking , fish eyes and the like. You dont need to use stripper . There are several different inexpensive methods available ( media blasting, 3M paint buster system) and would take about the same amount of time as you already have in this panel. Stripping the panel also allows you to determine where the repairs and damage are . There are just to many sins usually hidden under the paint and primer. Get away from the Rustoleum and farm equipment products and follow the instructions on the labels. Mixing or reducing with the wrong solvent eventually will cause some issue with the primer and paint . Yes some will state they did it this way and it works but if you want to produce a long lasting quality finish it just dont work. Stay with products designed for automotive use. Du pont,SW, PPG all have lesser priced materials and lines and they are much better choices . Always apply a thin coat of a proper zinc based primer to all bare metal. Primer is a filling material and has no adhesion or rust inhibiting qualities, hence the need for the zinc. Spray a contrasting guide coat over the primer before blocking . Just dusting a light coat of aerosol over the panel is all thats needed. It will help identify the imperfections when you start blocking. Need a cheap long board. Find a good straight wooden paint mixing stick. Wrap it with a 8x11 sheet of 180 grit sandpaper and block the entire panel with overlapping 45 degree intersects. This method actually works better than many of the fancy long boards and special papers . Use a sealer between your primer and color . It keeps the color from soaking into the primer and dulling out the top coat.