Front brakes keep glazing and make noise

[JTCN]

I've probably pulled my front wheels off 5 times messing with these brakes and now I need to ask for advice.

The car is a '75 280z, all stock brake components except for maybe the pads. They're the same ones I bought with the car 1 and a half years ago.

Every time I brake I get this HORRIBLY loud squeak/squeal/grind noise coming from both the front wheels.

The noise changes depending on how hard I brake, sometimes if I brake really hard it doesn't squeal at all except maybe a little noise.

The loudest noises come from light braking.

All of my front brake pads have plenty of meat left on them. They honestly look new there's so much.

Every time I've checked the pads and rotors they've been glazed. So I pull off the pads and sand them pretty good with rough sandpaper and do the same with the rotors.

After I sanded the pads and rotors on both sides and start driving, it's great. Barely a peep out of them for the first drive.

But the next day/couple days later they start progressively making the horrible noise again, and they glaze again.

Also I found that if I spin my rotor with the pads and caliper on, I hear kind of a light scraping noise. It only happens on some spots on the rotor, rest is silent.

 

I'm so over dealing with this I think it's time to just buy new rotors and brake pads. Maybe even do the toyota 4x4 caliper swap.

But I don't want to spend money on it considering I believe both the rotors and pads have good life on them.

I just replaced all studs on my drivers side front wheel and repacked the wheel bearings too, so I don't wanna pull off that rotor again.

 

What do you guys think? Should I just bite the bullet and replace my brakes? Anyone else have similar trouble?

My worst nightmare is replacing the rotors and pads to find out it still makes noise. I just want this embarrassing noise gone.

Thanks

[NewZed]

Do you have the factory shims behind the pads?  Might just be squealing.  Not sure what you mean by glazing, they're going to get shiny.  Does performance change?

[JMortensen]

Use high temp brake grease on the back of the pads. Might also try a different pad.

[JTCN]

Do you have the factory shims behind the pads?  Might just be squealing.  Not sure what you mean by glazing, they're going to get shiny.  Does performance change?

If you're referring to something like this (http://www.thezstore.com/page/TZS/PROD/24-5450) then no. When I pulled off my pads they didn't have shims on the back, just a layer of anti-squeal paste or something right on the pad.

No performance change that I could really tell.

Edited June 1, 2017 by JTCN

[NewZed]

Many people have found that certain pads will always end up squealing unless they have those shims.  

 

I asked about performance because "glazing" generally lowers stopping power.  If there's already goop on the pads, you might try more grease or spray-on anti-squeal and see if it gets better.  I fought squealing brakes for quite a while, until I found some shims.

[JTCN]

Many people have found that certain pads will always end up squealing unless they have those shims.  

 

I asked about performance because "glazing" generally lowers stopping power.  If there's already goop on the pads, you might try more grease or spray-on anti-squeal and see if it gets better.  I fought squealing brakes for quite a while, until I found some shims.

Thanks for the help. Had no idea a little thing like a shim might be the problem.

I guess I'm going to order a set of those shims and try them out.

Also last time I pulled the pads I took a razor and tried scraping most of the goop off the back of the pads. Should I order some anti-squeal stuff and reapply?

 

Edit: Just noticed thezstore doesn't have the "LH" shims in stock. Anywhere else I could get some?

Edited June 1, 2017 by JTCN

[AkumaNoZeta]

We had the same exact noise problem when we installed new pads on the 10/74' 260Z. When we removed them and looked at them, they had some shiny silver spots in it. Rotors were freshly turned so I think some steel or something might have been accidently poured into the pad material. We replaced them with another set of new ones, same brand and everything, but this time they didn't have the silver spots and were noise free. I should add that the shop I used to work for always used the cheapest parts available, including pads, so that didn't help. One of the reasons why I quit.

[NewZed]

 

Edit: Just noticed thezstore doesn't have the "LH" shims in stock. Anywhere else I could get some?

 

In a recent thread here or on another forum somebody realized that if the little right angle tab on the top of the shim is broken off you can use them on either side.  The tab seems to be for installation ease.

 

Grim's new pad idea is a good one though.  I'd go with the organic material, avoid the ceramic.

[JTCN]

In a recent thread here or on another forum somebody realized that if the little right angle tab on the top of the shim is broken off you can use them on either side.  The tab seems to be for installation ease.

 

Grim's new pad idea is a good one though.  I'd go with the organic material, avoid the ceramic.

Okay so I could order 2 sets of these shims and just break off the little tabs on 1 set to use for the "LH" side.

I guess I might as well order new pads. But I noticed that thezstore has the OEM brake pads for $70 compared to something like this (http://www.thezstore.com/page/TZS/PROD/classic21o02/24-4960) which is $40.

Is it really more worth it to go for the OEM?

[NewZed]

I used the Posi-Quiets and didn't like them.  They're ceramic (hence my comment) and will keep your wheels cleaner and will last longer but they don't have good braking feel.  Always felt like I had just driven through a puddle at first pedal press.  Definitely;y not "more stopping power".   And I love having the sponsors for the sites and appreciate the other parts they sell but you can get those pads for about $25 from Rock-Auto or Amazon.

 

Beck-Arnley pads are about as close to OEM as you can get I think.

 

https://www.amazon.com/Beck-Arnley-085-1175-Premium-Brake/dp/B00HFJC7SM/ref=au_as_r?_encoding=UTF8&Make=Nissan%7C67&Model=280Z%7C874&Year=1975%7C1975&ie=UTF8&n=15684181&newVehicle=1&s=automotive&vehicleId=1&vehicleType=automotive

 

http://www.rockauto.com/en/catalog/nissan,1975,280z,2.8l+l6,1209204,brake+&+wheel+hub,brake+pad,1684

[JTCN]

I used the Posi-Quiets and didn't like them.  They're ceramic (hence my comment) and will keep your wheels cleaner and will last longer but they don't have good braking feel.  Always felt like I had just driven through a puddle at first pedal press.  Definitely;y not "more stopping power".   And I love having the sponsors for the sites and appreciate the other parts they sell but you can get those pads for about $25 from Rock-Auto or Amazon.

 

Beck-Arnley pads are about as close to OEM as you can get I think.

 

https://www.amazon.com/Beck-Arnley-085-1175-Premium-Brake/dp/B00HFJC7SM/ref=au_as_r?_encoding=UTF8&Make=Nissan%7C67&Model=280Z%7C874&Year=1975%7C1975&ie=UTF8&n=15684181&newVehicle=1&s=automotive&vehicleId=1&vehicleType=automotive

 

http://www.rockauto.com/en/catalog/nissan,1975,280z,2.8l+l6,1209204,brake+&+wheel+hub,brake+pad,1684

Thanks for the link. Looks like those Beck-Arnley pads already come with shims on the back. Would those be good enough to use instead of having to order the OEM shims?

[NewZed]

I found that only the factory shims, like the MSA shims, worked, long-term.  The stick on shims just didn't work.

Edited June 1, 2017 by NewZed

[McGruber21]

Be careful sanding the rotors, it could cut the rotor material unevenly (acting similarly to a warped rotor) vibrating the pad and causing the squealing. On my 78 280z I bought (on rock auto) Premium rotors that they offered and then Beck-Arnley brake pads with the shims on it. Overall around 65 dollars plus shipping, and I applied copper brake grease upon install and 3 months later have had no problems. Hope this helps.

[JTCN]

Be careful sanding the rotors, it could cut the rotor material unevenly (acting similarly to a warped rotor) vibrating the pad and causing the squealing. On my 78 280z I bought (on rock auto) Premium rotors that they offered and then Beck-Arnley brake pads with the shims on it. Overall around 65 dollars plus shipping, and I applied copper brake grease upon install and 3 months later have had no problems. Hope this helps.

Thanks, I think I'll go the same route as you. Really don't wanna replace my rotors but they look like they really need it.

I already managed to bust off the rotor from the hub on my driver's side when I did the studs, so hopefully the passenger side will go with no issue.

[Miles]

How did you bed the pads?

[JTCN]

Alright I just ordered a set of Beck-Arnley brake pads off rockauto.

I only bought brake pads, no rotors. When my pads get here I'll try them with the shims that came with them. If it still makes noise I'll either replace my rotors or buy those oem shims.

 

 

How did you bed the pads?

I wasn't aware I had to bed pads. I just looked up a guide about it so when the pads get here I'll definitely do that. Thanks

Edited June 4, 2017 by JTCN

[BluDestiny]

Also what pads and rotors do you have? 

[JTCN]

Hey guys it's time for an update.

My brake pads came in today and I dove right into installing them.

I replaced the pads, got the wheels back on and went for a 40 min drive.

I didn't hear a single peep out of the brakes. None! It was great.

I tried bedding the pads by doing the 35 mph stops to 60 mph stops etc.

So I'm pretty excited to finally have this done and save my ears a little.

I don't know if it's the new pads or the shims on the back that stopped the noise but I definitely recommend them.

Here's a link to the pads:   http://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo.php?pk=5229747&cc=1209204

 

Over the next few days if I hear the noise come back again I'll update this thread and let y'all know.

Thanks for the help guys

[jacky4566]

Recommended bed-in procedures from each manufacturer:

AKEBONO
400 to 500 miles of moderate driving is recommended. Consumer should avoid heavy braking during this period.

ATE
400 to 500 miles of moderate driving is recommended. Consumer should avoid heavy braking during this period.

BREMBO GRAN TURISMO
In a safe area, apply brakes moderately from 60mph to 30mph and then drive approximately 1/2 mile to allow the brakes to cool. Repeat this procedure approximately 30 times.

HAWK
After installing new pads make 6 to 10 stops from approximately 35 mph with moderate pressure. Make an additional two to three hard stops from approximately 40 to 45 mph. Do not allow the vehicle to come to a complete stop.When completed with this process, park the vehicle and allow the brakes to cool completely before driving on them again. Do not engage the parking brake until after this cooling process is compete.

[RebekahsZ]

Change pads. Drive the shit out of it.