manninen Posted January 18, 2020 Share Posted January 18, 2020 (edited) Bmw E30 M3 went sway bar to strut from normal E30 sway bar to control arm for more efficient leverage, M3 uses lighter and thinner front sway bar. Anyone weld tab to strut? I made quick look and it sure does doable to early S30 Edited January 18, 2020 by manninen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grannyknot Posted January 18, 2020 Share Posted January 18, 2020 I guess it's much easier to get a hold of bmw parts than it is to have aftermarket Datsun parts shipped over to you. Yes you can weld on to the strut, the only thing that might possibly be a problem is you'll have a lot more pressure on the ball joint than you would normally. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TUME Posted January 19, 2020 Share Posted January 19, 2020 Parts source isn´t the issue here, i think. You can use any car parts here, if they fit. I´ve noticed that here in Finland car guys are more creative and everything don´t have to be bolt-on.😜 I wouldn´t stress about forces to the ball joint or things like that. Especially if you use ligther sway bar. Attaching pickup point to the strut would cause much more stiffer sway bar. It´s all about suspension arm motion ratio. Same effect for the springs here-> https://www.hypercoils.com/spring-rate-calculator/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manninen Posted January 19, 2020 Author Share Posted January 19, 2020 (edited) Just measured i need 190mm swaybar link, i know MOT guys might not like cutted and welded link but its 10min job to attach sway bar to factory points for MOT. im doing this mod https://www.ebay.com/itm/BMW-E30-E36-sway-bar-strut-mount-weld-brackets/253877569934?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649 But again i have to criticise these parts, look how much you lose to leverage. you can only get softer with these parts But for the effectiveness to leverage to bmw it´s about +2mm (18mm bar acts as 20mm bar) but cause 240z sway bar mount is closer to lower ball joint im guessing +1mm for effectiveness Quick google to 190mm sway bar link says crown vic link might fit, thats not cheap find in Finland https://www.ebay.com/itm/165mm-210mm-Ball-Joint-Adjustable-Roll-Sway-Bar-End-Link-For-Lexus-Toyota-Nissan/264294647769?hash=item3d893047d9:g:Fd4AAOSwGhFcvW8f These are easiest. But citroen parts are 5€ each, just need to cut and weld Edited January 19, 2020 by manninen 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HuD 91gt Posted January 19, 2020 Share Posted January 19, 2020 Is it required to stick with a OEM joint of some kind? Can’t you make an adjustable length link from some heim joints? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manninen Posted January 19, 2020 Author Share Posted January 19, 2020 At this point i wont use those cause price and longevity and i find that shape of link best for this mod at this point. Gaining weight again with this mod Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LLave Posted January 21, 2020 Share Posted January 21, 2020 On 1/19/2020 at 2:01 AM, manninen said: Just measured i need 190mm swaybar link, i know MOT guys might not like cutted and welded link but its 10min job to attach sway bar to factory points for MOT. im doing this mod https://www.ebay.com/itm/BMW-E30-E36-sway-bar-strut-mount-weld-brackets/253877569934?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649 But again i have to criticise these parts, look how much you lose to leverage. you can only get softer with these parts But for the effectiveness to leverage to bmw it´s about +2mm (18mm bar acts as 20mm bar) but cause 240z sway bar mount is closer to lower ball joint im guessing +1mm for effectiveness Quick google to 190mm sway bar link says crown vic link might fit, thats not cheap find in Finland https://www.ebay.com/itm/165mm-210mm-Ball-Joint-Adjustable-Roll-Sway-Bar-End-Link-For-Lexus-Toyota-Nissan/264294647769?hash=item3d893047d9:g:Fd4AAOSwGhFcvW8f These are easiest. But citroen parts are 5€ each, just need to cut and weld Paralysis by analysis. Is this leverage a real problem? Seems like there are plenty of well sorted, fast Z's out there overcoming this issue. But then again, this is hybridz, blaze your own path. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manninen Posted January 22, 2020 Author Share Posted January 22, 2020 Would not call it a problem, its just finding best driving character for you. Could even be 20mm bar to strut same as 1" bar to apex control arm second softest spot. Me having 18mm and 20mm bars i have 4 different swaybar settings on front Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twisted46 Posted January 29, 2020 Share Posted January 29, 2020 I think the idea is cool but I am not seeing what the benefit is? Simply to use a smaller bar? Reduced roll moment? Just for funsies? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMortensen Posted January 29, 2020 Share Posted January 29, 2020 Longer links have less angle change as the bar moves. The angle change affects the spring rate of the bar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manninen Posted January 29, 2020 Author Share Posted January 29, 2020 (edited) With euro struts links would be longer, my car is us model. Sway bar tabs are hard/impossible with coil over threads. Twisted46: weight reduction mostly, id liked to know 18, 20 and 1" weights edit: 18mm front swaybar weight 2.5kg realized another thing what i can do, more later Edited January 29, 2020 by manninen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manninen Posted January 30, 2020 Author Share Posted January 30, 2020 (edited) 18mm sway bar 2.5kg 20mm sway bar 3kg, lighter than i thought thing is those tabs on strut forward link mounting point 25-30mm, link has some angle if its gonna be hooked straight to stock sway bar. So... to get that angle straight here is shortened 18mm sway bar. Edited January 30, 2020 by manninen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
260DET Posted January 31, 2020 Share Posted January 31, 2020 As grannyknot said, what about the ball joints? At a quick glance to me it seems that the sway bar will exert an upward thrust load on the ball joint as well as the usual downward thrust, a load the ball joint is not designed for. It's all very well being creative but in my experience any mod like this has to be thought through and the benefits weighed against the negatives. If sway bar operation is unsatisfactory then eg look at using a three piece bar running on solid bearings to give a much more progressive response. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manninen Posted January 31, 2020 Author Share Posted January 31, 2020 (edited) Lower ball joint and sway bar links is stressed at stock mounting and only sway bar links are stressed on strut mounting. And everybody knows factory links last life time but are cushy without PU bushings, ball joint links are more rigid but wont last long. Sway bar mounting points on frame rails stress as stock 18mm Choose your path Edited January 31, 2020 by manninen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TUME Posted January 31, 2020 Share Posted January 31, 2020 Roll bar connected at strut are not creating upward stress to balljoint. It only reduce downward force. It`s not lifting wheel of the road isn`t it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manninen Posted January 31, 2020 Author Share Posted January 31, 2020 (edited) Sure it´s 2-way force, hit a bump sway bar tries to lever that force, thats why strong bars give more rough ride. And path of that force you can see above Edited January 31, 2020 by manninen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manninen Posted February 5, 2020 Author Share Posted February 5, 2020 Ookkay... mod is done and what i´ve notice this link angle that turning wheel binds sway bar a little. Turning wheels right, right side tyre goes slightly up and left side goes slightly down (sway bar movement such as you´re cornering left) not 100% happy about it but glad it´s not other way around. But i don´t know what it does to steering, driving over bump it might give some steering input, dont know it yet. When putting car first time sideways i know if i have to put it back to stock or trying that shortened 18mm bar with better link angles Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LLave Posted February 5, 2020 Share Posted February 5, 2020 I applaud you trying something different. I wonder how that will act in a long sweeping turn. Holding steering input and having roll. I would imagine it will pull on the strut and have some steering input. But I have no real world experience. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manninen Posted February 5, 2020 Author Share Posted February 5, 2020 I might not even have as much movement as this car has Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gnosez Posted February 7, 2020 Share Posted February 7, 2020 Cut holes through the engine bay rails, weld in a length of tubing and run a solid bar thru like they did in back in the day. The diameter of the bar and the length away from the bar to the attachment point would give you a wide range of adjustment while cleaning up the clutter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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