Mack Posted August 13, 2009 Share Posted August 13, 2009 no welding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daeron Posted August 14, 2009 Share Posted August 14, 2009 no welding. mack, re read his post and then click the video linked. Sarcasm FTW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
josh817 Posted August 16, 2009 Share Posted August 16, 2009 John has built up rage. If he attended the same highschool as I did, I'd report into the anonymous tip services for troubled people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wash1311 Posted November 8, 2009 Share Posted November 8, 2009 Holy cow that's extremely impressive Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
softopz Posted November 12, 2009 Share Posted November 12, 2009 1fz what nice work you have done. From what I have read your running a copper headgasket. My question is does the block HAVE to be O ring for a copper headgasket setup...cause Iam looking for a thicker headgasket for the L28et and cant find anything except copper. I know you have to heat it up first and make sure its really clean, and also its re usable, but I havent got a for sure answer about the O ring part. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aliphian Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 Great job OP. I am so happy that for once, I started reading an old build thread and I actually saw it completed. You are the man! Any new dyno numbers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PandaZ Posted November 23, 2009 Share Posted November 23, 2009 shinjigatai Mate thats an awesome effort, amazingly impressive! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nismo280zEd Posted November 24, 2009 Share Posted November 24, 2009 Amazing build. Hats off to you. After reading this thread I no longer want a cross flow head for the L motor lol. WAY too much work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sq_creations Posted November 24, 2009 Share Posted November 24, 2009 Awesome work 1 fast Z. Did you ever get dyno numbers for the new setup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1 fast z Posted December 6, 2009 Author Share Posted December 6, 2009 A bit of an update! Well Then engine had to come back apart again. Multiple problems. The head is actually the most stable part of the build right now, ha. First of all, I installed a Z32 RPS six puck disk and pressure plate about a year ago. The clutch is WAY too much pressure for the thrust bearing in the engine. THe stroker crank is trashed, because the thrust bearing wore completly through and the crank was riding right on the back of the main cap and block. I have always been carefull to not hold the clutch in when I dont need to, ie. when at stop lights, waiting for the flagman at race tracks to wave me on etc. The car needs that much clutch, so I cannot put a weaker clutch. I am in the process of designing a new style thrust bearing that goes inbetween the back of the cranks, right on the flange where the flywheel bolts to, and inbetween the block. Next, The 440.00 dollar harmonic balencer from BHJ has failed. They make the hubs out of alluminum. I should of cought this before I installed the unit. You cannot have a press fit of about .002" from the ID of the harmonic to the OD of the crank snout, with the hub out of alluminum. When that crank and snout and the harmonic hub gets to 200 degrees, you loose all of that press fit, for the reason of material exansion difference in rates between alluminum and steel. From my calculations, it becomes .002" clearence at that temperature. The keyway in the harmonic, and on the crank was both "wallard" out. Once this all happened, the bolt got loose and the harmonic started to walk forward. I use Red high temp locktite, long custom made bolt, Thick 17-4ph stainless custom made washer, and 150 lbs of torque. Once the harmonic walked forward, and the thrust bearing on the crank was wore out, the lower timing chain sprocket mooved so far forward that the double roller custom timing chain had not been straight on the sprocket, and broke the lower timing sprocket, (also custom). I am not sure what you guys with high pressure clutches do for thrust, but the size of the L series thrust washer is REALLY small for high pressure clutches. At the price and availibility of V07 cranks, I cannot afford to keep trashing them. I will post pics on my new thrust design also. It also looks like that with 600 ft lbs of torque and 700 plus RWHP, that the cylinder bores are not staying round, even with an extra thick block. I have sonic tested this block to be an average of .125" walls with an 89mm bore. I am now going with an 87mm bore with another extra thick block, to maintain more cylinder wall thickness for my HP and TQ numbers. Z32 pistons will work great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daeron Posted December 7, 2009 Share Posted December 7, 2009 Next, The 440.00 dollar harmonic balencer from BHJ has failed. They make the hubs out of alluminum. I should of cought this before I installed the unit. You cannot have a press fit of about .002" from the ID of the harmonic to the OD of the crank snout, with the hub out of alluminum. When that crank and snout and the harmonic hub gets to 200 degrees, you loose all of that press fit, for the reason of material exansion difference in rates between alluminum and steel. From my calculations, it becomes .002" clearence at that temperature. Thanks for the all-encompassing update on the engine. You seem to have listed the same number twice here, and I am not sure if that was purposeful (and you didn't list a preferred tolerance) or if it was a typo, and the first number was intended to be a more ideal relative sizing. Since your opinion as a machinist and hi-po L6 builder is respected, I wanted that a little clearer for future reference. Obviously this is all in regards to 5-600 hp + machines, but the better the data, the better the HybridZ... right? Incidentally, are you planning on using another stroker crank at 87mm? Or were you going to try the head out on a more stockish, 2.8 liter setup? If I were in your shoes, I would be wondering if you might be able to eke the same power, with greater reliability, out of less displacement and more boost (when wanted, of course.) The answer to that question would be one benefit of the experiment, but it would also give you an opportunity to try out your new thrust washer design without risking another diesel crank. Just my thoughts. If you haven't figured me out yet, I have always believed that there was no such thing as a bad idea, because any idea can shed light. Even ideas rejected entirely draw boundaries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony D Posted December 7, 2009 Share Posted December 7, 2009 JeffP already has a steel centered unit from BHJ, they can make one, they already have. The thurst washer issue was why most JDM high HP cars ran multiple disc clutch assemblies and just dealt with the overhaul cost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnH Posted December 7, 2009 Share Posted December 7, 2009 Thats the 3rd BHJ dampner that I know has failed (mine included) for the same very reason. I spent a couple of hours repairing the keyway on my crank beacuse of it. This dampner with a SFI rating should not be failing so quickly for this reason. I had barely 5k on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
josh817 Posted December 7, 2009 Share Posted December 7, 2009 Pictures of crank? :/ I'm worried Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PandaZ Posted December 7, 2009 Share Posted December 7, 2009 Would it be possible to make a pull-type clutch, such as the late r33 uses or would that cause a similar problem on the other side of the crank journal? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1 fast z Posted December 7, 2009 Author Share Posted December 7, 2009 This shows the bearing. Notice the difference in thickness. Here is both sides of the bad bearings. This is what they should look like. Here is what a 450.00 balencer looks like Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnH Posted December 7, 2009 Share Posted December 7, 2009 That last pic is exactly what my failed BHJ dampner looked like in the keyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnc Posted December 7, 2009 Share Posted December 7, 2009 The car needs that much clutch, so I cannot put a weaker clutch. Time for a multi-disk setup. I had the same problem and trashed a crank. Went to a double disc and got more clamping power with less spring pressure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1 fast z Posted December 7, 2009 Author Share Posted December 7, 2009 Response from Chris at BHJ. Hello Bryan, Thanks for the email. We have been making the aluminum dual-pulley damper as more-or-less a hopped-up OEM-replacement for many years now and have not heard about any problems, except in cases where the damper has been installed, removed and re-installed onto a crank (or multiple cranks) several times. In cases like that, the aluminum does not return back to size to the degree steel does and that is part of the reason we came out with the new all-steel version. If that is not the case, then there must have been something that came loose at some point to lead to this problem. The majority of our customers are very concerned about weight and that is what led to this damper originally being made with the aluminum outer-ring. It was only recently that we had a request for the steel outer hub and that customer has been installing/removing his damper almost every year since he first bought it and that was the first production version of the part. He is now putting the rebuilt-steel version on a Bonneville car. Sorry, but we can not warranty the damper repair, but we can do the hub replacement on the existing damper, using either the aluminum or steel outer shell (your choice, same price). The steel outer hub is bare steel and will need to be sprayed with clear coat or regular paint to keep it from rusting. Standard hub replacements are $225.00 at Jobber Discount. Thanks for the email and let me know what you'd like to do. If you send it in, I will need to give you an RMA number, so it will be accepted in Shipping. Cheers, Chris @ BHJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
josh817 Posted December 7, 2009 Share Posted December 7, 2009 Is this problem prevelant on clutches meant for only 3-400ftlb of torque too? I sit on the clutch at stop lights very often. :/ Scared me now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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